Inertial Reference Frames and Newtons laws

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Homework Help Overview

The discussion revolves around the concept of inertial reference frames in the context of Newton's laws of motion. Participants are exploring what qualifies as an inertial frame and the implications of acceleration on these definitions.

Discussion Character

  • Conceptual clarification, Assumption checking

Approaches and Questions Raised

  • Participants are attempting to classify various scenarios as inertial or non-inertial reference frames based on their understanding of constant velocity and acceleration. Questions arise regarding the distinction between speed and velocity, particularly in cases involving curves and free fall.

Discussion Status

Some participants have provided insights into why certain frames are not considered inertial, emphasizing the role of acceleration. There is an ongoing exploration of different examples, with some participants expressing confusion about specific cases, such as a car driving around a curve and a skydiver in free fall.

Contextual Notes

Participants mention the influence of general relativity on the interpretation of inertial frames, indicating a potential gap in understanding between classical and modern physics concepts.

Blangett
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Homework Statement



I am a bit confused about what are inertial reference frames and what is not. The text states:

"We define an inertial reference frame as a reference frame in which Newton's laws are valid... Accelerating reference frames are not inertial reference frames. Consequently, Newton's laws are not valid in a reference frame attached to an accelerating object. ... In Chapter 4 we defined inertial reference frames to be those reference frames moving with constant velocity."

Would someone mind explaining the reasoning to these answers a bit better, and make sure my reasoning is correct.



The Attempt at a Solution



Are the following inertial reference frames? Yes or No.

A car driving at a stead speed on a straight and level road. ~ Yes I understand this one because the car is moving at a constant velocity so it is an inertial
reference frame.

A car driving at a steady speed up a 10 degree incline. ~ Yes
The car is moving at a constant velocity so it is an inertial reference frame.

A car speeding up after leaving a stop sign. ~ No
The car is accelerating so it is not an inertial reference frame.

A car driving at steady speed around a curve. ?
I found the answer to be no, but I do not understand why. If it is moving at a
constant speed shouldn't it be an inertial reference frame.

A hot air balloon rising straight up at steady speed. ~ Yes
Constant velocity so inertial reference frame.

A skydiver just after leaping out of a plane. ~ No
Not positive, but I think on this one its just because they are accelerating in free fall.

The space shuttle orbiting the earth. ~ ?
I know the answer is no, but I am not sure exactly why.
 
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Blangett said:

Homework Statement




A car driving at steady speed around a curve. ?
I found the answer to be no, but I do not understand why. If it is moving at a
constant speed shouldn't it be an inertial reference frame.

NO. It's the velocity that has to be constant, not just the speed. If it's moving around a curve, it's accelerating. Accelerating reference frames are not inertial. Are Newton's laws obeyed in accelerating reference frames? No. When you're going around a turn, there seems to be a mysterious force that throws you towards the outside of the turn. Where the hell did it come from?

Blangett said:
A skydiver just after leaping out of a plane. ~ No
Not positive, but I think on this one its just because they are accelerating in free fall.

Yes. Accelerating reference frames are not inertial.

Blangett said:
The space shuttle orbiting the earth. ~ ?
I know the answer is no, but I am not sure exactly why.

For the same reason as the car going around the curve
 
cepheid said:
NO. It's the velocity that has to be constant, not just the speed. If it's moving around a curve, it's accelerating. Accelerating reference frames are not inertial. Are Newton's laws obeyed in accelerating reference frames? No. When you're going around a turn, there seems to be a mysterious force that throws you towards the outside of the turn. Where the hell did it come from?



Yes. Accelerating reference frames are not inertial.



For the same reason as the car going around the curve

Thank you so much!
 
Blangett said:
A skydiver just after leaping out of a plane. ~ No
Not positive, but I think on this one its just because they are accelerating in free fall.

This is a bit of an unfortunate question: if you know too much (namely general relativity), then you'll answer that a body in free fall is THE example of an inertial frame.

But in Newtonian physics you'd indeed say you're accelerating so it's certainly not an inertial frame!
 

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