Ionisation by a magnetic field?

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Discussion Overview

The discussion centers around the potential for ionization of atoms by a magnetic field, exploring whether a sufficiently strong magnetic field could overcome the binding energy of electrons in neutral atoms. Participants consider the implications of this idea for forming negative ions and the theoretical power requirements for such magnetic fields.

Discussion Character

  • Exploratory
  • Debate/contested
  • Technical explanation

Main Points Raised

  • One participant proposes that a powerful magnetic field could tear electrons and nuclei apart, potentially leading to ionization.
  • Another participant questions the logic behind this idea and emphasizes the distinction between magnetic and electric fields, stating that electric fields can ionize atoms, while magnetic fields cannot do so by themselves.
  • A different participant suggests that while strong magnetic fields might ionize some atoms, current laboratory-generated fields are insufficient or destructive.
  • One participant mentions the Paschen-Back effect and provides formulas related to energy changes in magnetic fields, seeking clarification on their applicability.
  • Another participant references historical use of magnetic fields in isotope separation, implying that significant energy is required for such processes.
  • A later reply introduces a related question about the potential for magnetic fields to propel atoms into collisions with ferromagnetic materials.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants express differing views on the capability of magnetic fields to ionize atoms, with some supporting the idea and others contesting it. There is no consensus on the feasibility or mechanisms involved.

Contextual Notes

Participants mention various formulas and effects without reaching a definitive conclusion on their relevance or correctness. The discussion reflects uncertainty about the strength of magnetic fields required for ionization and the specific conditions under which this might occur.

Kael42
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Is it not possible that, given a powerful enough magnetic field, the binding energy of an electron in a stable, neutral atom could be overcome from the tearing of the negatively charged electrons in one direction, and of the positively charged nucleus in the other?

I have searched online, and there doesn't seem to be a mention to this anywhere...

If this were to be true, I imagine that it would have been used already to form otherwise unobtainable negative ions, and make brand new compounds. Such a revolution has obviously not happened, so what is the problem with my logic?

If the problem is that it requires too strong a magnetic field to be produced by human technology, how could the theoretical power required be calculated.

Cheers, Kael.
 
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Kael42 said:
so what is the problem with my logic?

Do you understand what a magnetic field is and how charged particles are affected by them?
 
I was fair sure I did, but it has been a while since I dealt with them, and your question seems to imply I don't. I'll google them to refresh my memory.
 
Took a look. Nothing seems to contradict the logic I found. Positive and negative particles are pulled in circles in opposing directions. In the case of an atom, It would simply be a fight between the pull of the field and and the binding energy of the electrons... wouldn't it?
 
No. Electric fields pull electrons and nucleii apart, and you can field-ionize atoms this way with sufficiently strong electric fields. What this has to do with "otherwise unobtainable negative ions", I do not have the slightest clue, but magnetic fields are not electric fields - they can change atomic structure and affect emission and absorption spectra, but they do not by themselves ionize atoms.
 
I'm a bit late here, but I think an enormously strong magnetic field could indeed ionize some atoms. The problem is that as far as I know the ones we obtain in the lab (see there: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Orders_of_magnitude_(magnetic_field )) are too small or they seem to blow up material.
I think we can use the formula [itex]\Delta E =m_l \mu _B B[/itex] (although I am not 100% sure, maybe this formula instead : [itex]\Delta E =(m_l+2m_s) \mu _B B[/itex]. Can someone tell me which one to use for a huge magnetic field?). For example we can take [itex]m_l=1[/itex].
In any case I suggest you to read about the Paschen-Back effect.
 
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I remember watching this episode about the manhatten project where they used magnets in isotope separation to help purify uranium.

http://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Isotope_separation

This required an large amount of energy. I think its safe to say your system would require quite a bit more.
 
Hey guys, I was wondering if anyone could expound on this question, even though it's old, I wanted to add into the question here on whether a magnetic field could be strong enough to propel the atoms into collision with some ferromagnetic element such as Iron.
 

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