Isolating the Y variable in a Trigonometric Equation

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Homework Help Overview

The discussion revolves around isolating the variable y in the trigonometric equation 4y = cos(4πx + 3/2). Participants are exploring the validity of dividing both sides of the equation by 4 and the implications of doing so in the context of trigonometric functions.

Discussion Character

  • Conceptual clarification, Mathematical reasoning, Assumption checking

Approaches and Questions Raised

  • Some participants attempt to isolate y by dividing both sides by 4, questioning whether this is a valid operation. Others suggest that dividing only one factor in a product is necessary, prompting further exploration of the nature of the equation. There is also discussion about the distinction between functions and products in this context.

Discussion Status

Participants are actively engaging with the problem, offering insights and clarifications about the mathematical principles involved. There is a recognition of the confusion surrounding trigonometric functions and their manipulation, with some suggestions for reframing the problem to aid understanding.

Contextual Notes

Some participants express uncertainty about the rules governing division in equations involving trigonometric functions, indicating a need for clarity on these concepts. The discussion reflects a mix of algebraic manipulation and conceptual understanding related to trigonometric identities.

opus
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Homework Statement


##4y=cos\left(4πx+\frac{3}{2}\right)##

Homework Equations

The Attempt at a Solution


In dividing both sides by 4, I got:

##y=\frac{1}{4}cos\left(πx+\frac{3}{8}\right)## But I am told this is incorrect.
Not sure if dividing everything by 4 here is an allowable technique, or if I did it wrong, but I'm not sure where else to go other than isolating the y like this.
 
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Actually I think I got it. I tried dividing the LHS by 4 and ONLY the coefficient of cos on the RHS and that seemed to work. My algebra seems to go out the window when I see trig words, so why wouldn't I divide all factors on the RHS by 4?
 
opus said:

Homework Statement


##4y=cos\left(4πx+\frac{3}{2}\right)##

Homework Equations

The Attempt at a Solution


In dividing both sides by 4, I got:

##y=\frac{1}{4}cos\left(πx+\frac{3}{8}\right)## But I am told this is incorrect.
Not sure if dividing everything by 4 here is an allowable technique, or if I did it wrong, but I'm not sure where else to go other than isolating the y like this.
No, it is wrong. When dividing a product, you divide only one factor.
Think: what is y if 4y = 12? and what is y if 4y=3x4? Do you really think the two y values are different?
 
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Makes complete sense now. Thank you!
 
ehild said:
When dividing a product, you divide only one factor.
True, but ##\cos(4\pi x + \frac 3 2)## isn't a product.
Closer to the point, if ##4y = \sqrt{36}##, it would be incorrect to write ##y = \frac 1 4 \sqrt 9## (which happens to be ##\frac 3 4##). The corrected equation is ##y = \frac 1 4 \sqrt{36} = \frac 6 4 = \frac 3 2##.

Of course, with this equation, it would have been simpler to write it as 4y = 6, from which we get y = 3/2.
 
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Thank you Mark. So what would we call it if not a product? Just a typical function such as f(x) where we wouldn't be dividing the input of the function?
 
opus said:
Actually I think I got it. I tried dividing the LHS by 4 and ONLY the coefficient of cos on the RHS and that seemed to work. My algebra seems to go out the window when I see trig words, so why wouldn't I divide all factors on the RHS by 4?

If the trig function is throwing you off, just call it something else (temporarily). If you let ##C = \cos(4 \pi x + \frac 3 2)##, your original equation is ##4y = C,## and the solution is ##y = \frac1 4 C.## Now put back the value of ##C## in terms of ##x##. When you do that it becomes absolutely clear that you do not pull the ##\frac{1}{4}## inside the ##\cos( \cdot) ## function.
 
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Ray Vickson said:
If the trig function is throwing you off, just call it something else (temporarily). If you let ##C = \cos(4 \pi x + \frac 3 2)##, your original equation is ##4y = C,## and the solution is ##y = \frac1 4 C.##. Now put back the value of ##C## in terms of ##x##. When you do that it becomes absolutely clear that you do not pull the ##\frac{1}{4}## inside the ##\cos( \cdot) ## function.
Im going to try that! Thats a great idea, thank you.
 
opus said:
So what would we call it if not a product? Just a typical function such as f(x) where we wouldn't be dividing the input of the function?
Just call it a function. The expression "f(x)" does not mean "f times x", so it's definitely not a product. It's almost never the case that ##\frac 1 b f(x)## is equal to ##f(\frac 1 b x)##, so you generally can't "distribute" the factor ##\frac 1 b## to into the function.

Here are some example of what I mean:
##\frac 1 2 \sin(x) \ne \sin(\frac x 2)##
##\frac 1 3 \sqrt{x} \ne \sqrt{\frac x 3}##
##2e^x \ne e^{2x}##
and so on. In the above, ##\ne## should be interpreted as "not identically equal to." For some of my examples, there might be values of x that make the expressions on each side equal, but for most values of x, the paired expressions aren't equal.
 
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Thanks Mark!
 

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