Pick a,b,c,d for y=ax^3+bx^2+cx+d that models path of plane.

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Homework Help Overview

The problem involves modeling the descent path of a plane using a cubic polynomial equation of the form ##y=ax^3 + bx^2 + cx + d##. The plane starts from a height ##y = h## at the point ##x = -L## and lands at the origin ##(0,0)##. The requirement for the path to be "smooth" is a key aspect of the discussion.

Discussion Character

  • Exploratory, Assumption checking, Problem interpretation

Approaches and Questions Raised

  • Participants discuss the implications of the path being smooth, with some interpreting this as requiring tangency at the landing point. There are attempts to derive conditions for the coefficients ##a, b, c, d## based on the points the path must pass through and the behavior of the derivatives at those points.

Discussion Status

The discussion is ongoing, with participants exploring different interpretations of the smoothness condition and questioning the assumptions made about the derivatives at the endpoints. Some guidance has been offered regarding the necessity of the path passing through specific points and the behavior of the derivatives at those points.

Contextual Notes

There is a focus on the constraints of the problem, such as the requirement for the path to pass through ##(-L, h)## and ##(0,0)##, and the implications of the derivatives being zero at these points. The discussion also touches on the physical implications of the model in a real-world context.

McFluffy
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Homework Statement


A plane starts its descent from height ##y =h## at ##x = -L## to land at ##(0,0)##. Choose ##a, b, c, d## so its landing path ##y =ax^3 + bx^2 + cx + d## is "smooth". With ##\frac{\mathrm {d}x}{\mathrm {d}t} = V =##constant, find ##\frac{\mathrm {d}y}{\mathrm {d}t}## and ##\frac{\mathrm {d}^2y}{\mathrm {d}t^2}## at ##x =0## and ##x = -L##. (To keep ##\frac{\mathrm {d}^2y}{\mathrm {d}t^2}## small, a coast-to-coast plane starts down ##L > 100## miles from the airport.)

Homework Equations


Let ##y=ax^3 + bx^2 + cx + d## be the vertical distance of the plane as a function of its horizontal distance, ##x##.
Since ##\frac{\mathrm {d}x}{\mathrm {d}t} = V =##constant, let ##x=Vt-L## with the constant ##-L## because I want the plane to be at ##x=-L## when ##t=0##.

The Attempt at a Solution


First thing I did was to interpret what it means for the landing path of the plane to be "smooth". I interpreted this as the plane intersecting ##(0,0)## after being in mid-air which would mean that ##y=ax^3 + bx^2 + cx + d## is tangent to ##(0,0)##.

Since ##(0,0)## is on ##y=ax^3 + bx^2 + cx + d##, this implies ##d=0##, and since it's tangent to ##(0,0)##, this implies that the tangent line that's tangent to ##y=ax^3 + bx^2 + cx## would be ##y=0##, which would mean ##c=0##. So far, we have that ##y=ax^3 + bx^2##.

To find what ##y## would be as a function of time, ##t##, substitute ##x=Vt-L## into ##y## to get ##y=a(Vt-L)^3 + b(Vt-L)^2##. We know that at ##t=0##, ##y=h## so ##y=a(-L)^3 + b(-L)^2=-aL^3 + bL^2=h##.

Since the plane will stay on the ground after the time when it has landed, this would mean that ##\frac{\mathrm {d}y}{\mathrm {d}t}## at ##t=##time when plane has landed is ##0##. We first find when the plane has landed which correspond to solving for ##t## for ##x=Vt-L=0## which gives ##t=\frac{L}{V}##.

With this, ##\frac{\mathrm {d}y}{\mathrm {d}t}## at ##t=\frac{L}{V}## is ##0##. I tried finding the derivative, ##\frac{\mathrm {d}y}{\mathrm {d}t}## and setting it to ##t=\frac{L}{V}## but ended up with an identity ##0=0## so I tried finding ##\frac{\mathrm {d}^2y}{\mathrm {d}t^2}##
at the same ##t## ( because ##\frac{\mathrm {d}y}{\mathrm {d}t}## at ##t=\frac{L}{V}## is ##0##, this implies ##\frac{\mathrm {d}^2y}{\mathrm {d}t^2}## at ##t=\frac{L}{V}## is ##0##) and found ##b=0##(too many stuff to type out what the derivative, ##\frac{\mathrm {d}^2y}{\mathrm {d}t^2}## is, same thing thing with ##\frac{\mathrm {d}y}{\mathrm {d}t}## and have limited time, sorry.)

So ##y=ax^3 + bx^2 + cx + d=ax^3## and from ##-aL^3 + bL^2=h##, we get ##a=-\frac{h}{L^3}## which means ##y=-\frac{h}{L^3}x^3## with ##L>100##. And from this, we can compute what ##\frac{\mathrm {d}^2y}{\mathrm {d}t^2}## and ##\frac{\mathrm {d}y}{\mathrm {d}t}## and at ##x =0## and ##x = -L##.

Graphing the end result equation, it seems correct so is my solution correct?
 
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McFluffy said:
have limited time
You can save yourself some time with:
  • path has to go through (-L, h)
  • path has to go through (0,0)
  • at both these points ##dy\over dx## = 0

(in fact,this elimiates time altogether :smile:)
 
BvU said:
You can save yourself some time with:
  • path has to go through (-L, h)
  • path has to go through (0,0)
  • at both these points ##dy\over dx## = 0

(in fact,this elimiates time altogether :smile:)

The solution I typed however didn't assume ##dy\over dx## =0 at ##(-L, h)##. I'm only considering ##y =-\frac{h}{L^3}x^3## over the interval ##[-L, 0]## for the path of the plane.
 
Last edited:
So what is ##
dy\over dx## at (-L, h) in your solution :rolleyes: ?
 
BvU said:
So what is ##
dy\over dx## at (-L, h) in your solution :rolleyes: ?

Since I'm considering only the ##[-L,0]## interval, I would say that ##dy\over dx##(the limit is also one-sided) is negative for that point because the plane is going down to land. I think you're suggesting that the path of the plane before ##x=-L## is a straight horizontal line, then it starts going down. o_O Here's the graph of what I'm thinking of, I picked the constants, h and L as 75 and 200, respectively. https://www.desmos.com/calculator/9du7nducy8
 
Last edited:
McFluffy said:
I think you're suggesting that the path of the plane before x=−Lx=−Lx=-L is a straight horizontal line,
for the exercise, yes. In real life: as good as.

What airline are you flying for ? Kamikaze & co ? I sure would avoid it like ... The acceleration at -L would be lethal !
But the bodies would land very smooth indeed -- if only the plane would surive (-L,0) (it would not)
 
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You're absolutely right. I forgot the passengers in the plane. I fixed the solution and the end result equation will be ##y=\frac{2h}{L^3}x^3+\frac{3h}{L^2}x^2## and with this, the passenger will land safe and sound. :D https://www.desmos.com/calculator/5ah7z7cs11
 
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Bingo. At least: I'm personally convinced this is the answer the exercise writer wants. (I.e.: no guarantee :rolleyes: )

The knowledgeable student is probably confused: he thinks a linear approach path is desired, with a gentle transition at 'start of approach' and also at 'touchdown, with a downward linear path -3 degrees (under the guidance of papi :smile:).
 
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