Prove that x^4+y^4=1 is a manifold

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Discussion Overview

The discussion revolves around the question of whether the set of points defined by the equation x4 + y4 = 1 can be classified as a manifold. Participants explore various approaches to proving this, including comparisons to the unit circle and the use of stereographic projection.

Discussion Character

  • Exploratory
  • Technical explanation
  • Mathematical reasoning
  • Debate/contested

Main Points Raised

  • One participant seeks assistance in proving that x4 + y4 = 1 is a manifold, noting that proving it for the circle was straightforward.
  • Another participant inquires about the methods already attempted to prove the manifold property.
  • Some participants suggest using stereographic projection to create coordinate neighborhoods, although there is uncertainty about its effectiveness.
  • A participant proposes identifying open intervals that project back to provide coordinate charts, suggesting this could demonstrate that the set is a differentiable manifold.
  • One participant outlines a general method involving a smooth function and its derivatives, arguing that the conditions for a manifold are satisfied in this case.
  • Another participant emphasizes the need to construct coordinate neighborhoods directly, rather than relying solely on the implicit function theorem, and mentions the necessity of proving that the manifold is topologically equivalent to a circle.
  • A mathematical mapping between the set defined by x4 + y4 = 1 and the unit circle is proposed, with the suggestion that these mappings are smooth and inverses of each other, indicating a diffeomorphism.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants express differing views on the methods to prove the manifold property, with some supporting the use of the implicit function theorem while others advocate for direct construction of coordinate neighborhoods. The discussion remains unresolved regarding the best approach to take.

Contextual Notes

There are limitations regarding the assumptions made about the smoothness of the functions involved and the specific conditions under which the mappings are defined. The discussion does not resolve these assumptions or the implications of the proposed methods.

andromeda2
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Can someone help me out whit this
I proved for the circle, but I can't prove it for this

-Prove that x^4+y^4=1 (the set of points) is a manifold

For the circle it was easy, but how do I take on this case?

Thanks
 
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how have you tried to prove it?
 


I was thinking about a kind of stereographic projection
but I didn't know how to do this
 


a kind of stereographic projection to create coordinate neighborhoods?
 


yes exactly
Do you think that this will work? Then I try it again
 


my guess is that you should be able to identify open intervals that project back to give coordinate charts. This would give you a differentiable manifold. You then need to argue that it is diffeo to a circle.
 


Let f(x,y) be any smooth real valued function, and a be a real number. Then, the set of points (x,y) for which f(x,y) = a and df/dx, df/dy are not both zero is a manifold.

In this case, f(x,y) = x^4 + y^4, and df/dx = 4x^3, df/dy=4y^3, which can't both be zero when f=1. So, yes, the locus of points you describe is a manifold.

That's a very general method. In this case you can show that the locus of points is diffeomorphic to the circle, as already mentioned.
 


gel said:
Let f(x,y) be any smooth real valued function, and a be a real number. Then, the set of points (x,y) for which f(x,y) = a and df/dx, df/dy are not both zero is a manifold.

In this case, f(x,y) = x^4 + y^4, and df/dx = 4x^3, df/dy=4y^3, which can't both be zero when f=1. So, yes, the locus of points you describe is a manifold.

That's a very general method. In this case you can show that the locus of points is diffeomorphic to the circle, as already mentioned.

right but the problem was to construct coordinate neighborhoods. An appeal to the implicit function theorem is not a direct construction. But there is more to it. Once you know it is a manifold you need to prove that it is a topological circle (without appealing to the structure theorem for 1 manifolds.) With coordinate charts this should be easy to do.
 


if A = {(x,y) : x^4+y^4=1} and S={(x,y):x^2+y^2=1} is the unit circle, then you can define

<br /> \begin{align*}<br /> &amp;f\colon A\to S,\ f(x,y) \equiv (\lambda x, \lambda y),\ \lambda = (x^2+y^2)^{-\frac{1}{2}}\\<br /> &amp;g\colon S\to A,\ g(x,y) \equiv (\lambda x, \lambda y),\ \lambda = (x^4+y^4)^{-\frac{1}{4}}<br /> \end{align*}<br />

which are smooth maps and inverse to each other, showing that A,S are diffeomorphic.
 

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