Solving A problem using kinematics and Energy

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Homework Help Overview

The problem involves a 1.50 kg snowball fired from a 12.5 m high cliff with an initial velocity of 14.0 m/s at an angle of 41 degrees above the horizontal. Participants are exploring how to determine the speed of the snowball when it hits the ground using concepts from kinematics and energy conservation.

Discussion Character

  • Mixed

Approaches and Questions Raised

  • Participants discuss using conservation of mechanical energy and kinematic equations to find the final speed of the snowball. There are attempts to verify results through different methods, leading to questions about the role of horizontal velocity in the calculations.

Discussion Status

The discussion includes various attempts to solve the problem, with some participants suggesting that the horizontal component of velocity is not necessary for determining the speed at impact. Others question this assumption and explore the relationship between speed and velocity.

Contextual Notes

Participants note potential confusion regarding the inclusion of horizontal motion in the calculations and the distinction between speed and velocity. There is an acknowledgment of differing interpretations of the problem's requirements.

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Homework Statement


A ##1.50## kg snowball is fired from a cliff ##12.5##m high with an initial velocity of ##14.0## m/s, directed ##41^{\circ}## above the horizontal. How fast does the ball travel when it hits the ground.

Homework Equations


##E=K+U##
##V^2_f=v^2_i+2a(y_f-y_i)##
##y_f=v_i \sin \theta-gt^2##

The Attempt at a Solution


First using conservation of mechanical energy,
##E=(1/2mv_f^2-1/2mv^2_i)+(0-mgh)##
##v=\sqrt{v^2_i+2mgh} \implies v=\sqrt{14^2+2((9.8)(12.5)}=21m/s##

Using kinematics to verify,
##0=v_i\sin \theta -gt##
##t=\frac{v_i\sin \theta}{g}=\frac{14\sin 41}{9.8}=0.937 s##
##y_f=14\sin 41 (.937)-.5(9.8)(.937)^2=4.3m## which gives the height traveled above the horizontal
Calculate speed ##v=\sqrt{2(9.8)(12.5+4.3)}=18.14m/s##

Which is wrong they both look correct.
 
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lion_ said:

Homework Statement


A ##1.50## kg snowball is fired from a cliff ##12.5##m high with an initial velocity of ##14.0## m/s, directed ##41^{\circ}## above the horizontal. How fast does the ball travel when it hits the ground.

Homework Equations


##E=K+U##
##V^2_f=v^2_i+2a(y_f-y_i)##
##y_f=v_i \sin \theta-gt^2##

The Attempt at a Solution


First using conservation of mechanical energy,
##E=(1/2mv_f^2-1/2mv^2_i)+(0-mgh)##
##v=\sqrt{v^2_i+2mgh} \implies v=\sqrt{14^2+2((9.8)(12.5)}=21m/s##

Using kinematics to verify,
##0=v_i\sin \theta -gt##
##t=\frac{v_i\sin \theta}{g}=\frac{14\sin 41}{9.8}=0.937 s##
##y_f=14\sin 41 (.937)-.5(9.8)(.937)^2=4.3m## which gives the height traveled above the horizontal
Calculate speed ##v=\sqrt{2(9.8)(12.5+4.3)}=18.14m/s##

Which is wrong they both look correct.
The first method looks correct.

In the second method, you completely ignored the horizontal component of the velocity.
 
How is the horizontal component needed? The only thing we are concerned with is the height, thus once the snowball reaches maximum height, it becomes a one dimensional problem regardless of how fast the horizontal component is traveling. It is independent of gravity.
 
lion_ said:
How is the horizontal component needed? The only thing we are concerned with is the height, thus once the snowball reaches maximum height, it becomes a one dimensional problem regardless of how fast the horizontal component is traveling. It is independent of gravity.
How is it not needed?

Aren't you asked:
lion_ said:
How fast does the ball travel when it hits the ground.

How is speed related to velocity?
 
So you need to calculate ##v_f=\sqrt{v_x^2+v_y^2}=\sqrt{14^2\cos^2 41^{\circ}+(18.14)^2}=20.99## I guess that what was missing thanks.
 

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