News The evolution of your political beliefs

[Galteeth]

Here on physicsforums, there is a diverse range of political and moral belief. I am interested in the subject of how people form their political views.

At what age did you become politically aware? What was the biggest influence on your worldview? Did your morals and beliefs change over time? Are their specific events, people, art, books, etc. that had a big influence on what you believe? Was there ever an issue or event that made you re-examine previously held views?

 

[mugaliens]

Ok, after posting answers to all these questions, while suffering a simply mis-key wiping out half an hour of work, I hope you understand why I post my basic idea, first, before filling in the rest within, say, half an hour's time...

GAH! It's so frustrating to lose half an hour's worth of work, and I feel like what I wind up salvaging is but a rusty replica of the original.

Fix your board! Please!

Gah... And please forgive me if I post this in increments, as I will NOT do this a third time.

Thanks.

Here on physicsforums, there is a diverse range of political and moral belief. I am interested in the subject of how people form their political views.

At what age did you become politically aware?

Around seven, during the nightly news showing the Vietnam war.

What was the biggest influence on your worldview?

Jesus Christ, my Father, and multiple authors.

Did your morals and beliefs change over time?

Who's didn't? Show me, and I'll show you either Christ or someone incapable of assimilating information from their environment.

Are their specific events, people, art, books, etc. that had a big influence on what you believe?

(not in any specific order) Robert A. Heinlein. Clive Cussler. Jesus of Nazareth. Abraham. Bill Whittle. Billy Graham. Reagan. Carter. Bob. Dave. Steve. Another Steve. Charles. Mary Ann. Rufus. Carlos.

Was there ever an issue or event that made you re-examine previously held views?

I think the biggest event was when I was accepted into the military. I canvassed my friends, asking a few of them if they thought this was where I should be, and to a T, all of them, regardless of political affliation, agreed that's where I should go.

And I did.

 

[cobalt124]

Here goes.

At what age did you become politically aware?....

At about thirteen, when Margaret Thatcher came to power.

What was the biggest influence on your worldview?...

Sheltered, unquestioned, literal interpretation of Christianity in my upbringing.

Did your morals and beliefs change over time?....

Away from "truths" written in stone and towards my needs and others, more individual oriented, look after the small stuff and the big stuff looks after itself.

Are their specific events...

Maragret Thatcher coming to power had an effect on my family rather than me directly. Also any time an oppressed minority were "freed", I would get renewed hope for the world, such as the Berlin Wall coming down, events in South Afica, ordination of women priests (I wept!), gay rights advances.

people...

My dad was a staunch Labour supporting atheist and WWII veteran, who gave me a work ethic, a love for the simple things in life, and a total disregard for the importance of money.
My mum was a liberal Christian.
My best friend as a teenager was always very kind to animals, and I learned kindness from him.

art...

The only one I can think of is when something called the K Foundation burned a million pounds in the mid nineties as some sort of statement. I sometimes like to think I could do the same.

books...

The Selfish Gene. It gave the only reasonable answer to the question "Why am I here?" - the same reason as a blade of grass - to perpetuate genes. That felt wonderful. I told my sister that if you knew how a spider was made you you never kill one out of fear or disgust. She never managed to read the book, though.
The God Delusion - haven't read it right through, but this is the only book I've read that explained to me what consubstantial meant, and how the Virgin Birth made its way into the Gospels.
Shadows of the Mind. In my undergraduate days I was of the opinion that brains were basically machines, and Roger Penrose gives a near proof (how correct is irrevelant, the idea is important) that this cannot be so. That changed me.
The Good News Bible Gospels. I was away from home for the first time in my life on my industrial training year and very alone and depressed. Jesus Christ seemed a wonderful, kind man in this and reading it gave me hope.

Was there ever an issue or event that made you re-examine previously held views?

I can't recall specific events that profoundly changed me, I think I've been more of a slow plodder in that respect.

May add some more stuff if it comes to me.

 

[Ivan Seeking]

Here on physicsforums, there is a diverse range of political and moral belief. I am interested in the subject of how people form their political views.

At what age did you become politically aware?

I was following national politics closely by about age 12.

What was the biggest influence on your worldview?

Shooting from the hip here, I would say the oil crisis of the 1970s was a huge influence, as was Vietnam and the cold war. My direct exposure to welfare abuse, illegal immigration, gangland violence, alcohol and drug abuse, and the catastrophic effects of the so-called war on drugs, were also big influences.

Did your morals and beliefs change over time?

Yes. There was a time when I was a die-hard Republican. Now, I largely reject ideologies of all types. At most, ideologies should be viewed as pointers, not road maps. People becomes mindless slaves to a philosophy.

Are their specific events, people, art, books, etc. that had a big influence on what you believe?

The recent economic failure has proven to me that Ayn Rand was all wet and laizzes-faire capitalism is a pipe dream. While it may work in theory, we cannot allow corporations to run amok such that they can destroy the global economy. We cannot afford to live with the consequences of catastrophic market adjustments - esp those that could be avoided.

Was there ever an issue or event that made you re-examine previously held views?

Yes, the economic collapse has caused me to question everything I believed about free markets. In economic terms, excessive deregulation or non-regulation [derivatives] of financial markets nearly destroyed the world. Also, though I once campaigned for Reagan, I now believe Reaganomics was the beginning of our long slide into debt, as is evident by considering the national debt to GDP ratio. The public will gladly support tax breaks while also demanding services that drive the debt up [the classic paradox of democracy]. And there is never a time when the Republicans will raise taxes to meet the debt load. Instead, they insist on cutting spending to such a level that the public would never accept the consequences. It is a never-ending game of chasing our tails. Also, it is clear to me that supply-side economics failed due in large part to the exporting and outsourcing of jobs. Instead of trickling down, the money trickled away.

I also believe the Bush/Cheney administration posed a profound threat to the Constitution. At that time I saw the Republicans as a threat to the country. When GW Bush was elected the second time, I lost faith in my country. I may never again trust the Republican party.

When Obama was elected, hope was renewed. And he hasn't disappointed.

 

[Galteeth]

Ok, after posting answers to all these questions, while suffering a simply mis-key wiping out half an hour of work, I hope you understand why I post my basic idea, first, before filling in the rest within, say, half an hour's time...

GAH! It's so frustrating to lose half an hour's worth of work, and I feel like what I wind up salvaging is but a rusty replica of the original.

Fix your board! Please!

Gah... And please forgive me if I post this in increments, as I will NOT do this a third time.

Thanks.

I think i have had the same problem, where I write a long post, submit, and then am no longer logged in. What you can do is go back on your browser, you're writing should be there. You can then highlight the text, copy, log back in, and paste on a new response.

 

[Al68]

Yes, the economic collapse has caused me to question everything I believed about free markets. In economic terms, excessive deregulation or non-regulation [derivatives] of financial markets nearly destroyed the world.

You say that as if it were some kind of substantiated fact instead of unsubstantiated assertions (false propaganda).

It's pretty ironic that one can observe that the most regulated (least free market) industries in the country have the biggest problems in the country, problems logically impossible in a free market, then blame those problems on a lack of regulation (free market). Now that takes an efficient propaganda machine!

 

[Al68]

What was the biggest influence on your worldview? Did your morals and beliefs change over time? Are their specific events, people, art, books, etc. that had a big influence on what you believe?

Aristotle. Plato. John Locke. Karl Marx. Ayn Rand. Adam Smith. Frederic Bastiat. Thomas Hobbes. Austrian economics. Keynesian economics. My beliefs were probably influenced more by reading those with very different ideologies, like Marx, than those I agree with. For example, I learned practically nothing from reading Bastiat's http://bastiat.org/en/the_law.html" .

Was there ever an issue or event that made you re-examine previously held views?

Events can and have caused me to re-evaluate my positions on issues, but that's due to a change in relevant information, not a change in ideology. But event-dependent issue positions isn't ideology.

What continues to amaze me in this forum is that the very people who decry "ideology" are the ones who wear their ideology on their sleeve, making it consistently obvious in all their posts, as if they are completely unaware of their own ideology (or think that their ideology is universal). Or perhaps just a pretense to avoid having to acknowledge that opposing viewpoints exist for reasons other than bad motives.

 

[talk2glenn]

In economic terms, excessive deregulation or non-regulation [derivatives] of financial markets nearly destroyed the world.

What, pray tell, was deregulated, and how did this nearly destroy the world? Be specific, please, while keeping in mind that financial services is the most heavily regulated sector in the American economy (by number of regulations, number of bureaucrats enforcing those regulations, and the breadth of those regulations).

It's quite amusing to me to hear this line repeated ad nauseum to the complete ignorance of, you know, reality. The ideologues mind continues to boggle. Sorry for the off topic, but Ivan's nonsense demands righteous response

 

[Vanadium 50]

"If a man is not a socialist in his youth, he has no heart. If he is not a conservative by the time he is forty he has no head." - Georges Clemenceau

 

[alt]

Decades ago, when I first read Edmund Burke.

"The price of freedom is eternal vigilance"

and ..

"All that is necessary for the triumph of evil is that good men do nothing"

These alone sum it up for me.

 

[CAC1001]

Reading the two books books Capitalism and Freedom and Free to Choose by Milton Friedman were my first real serious introduction into thinking about issues. Before then, I was a supporter of market capitalism, but I had much less understanding about it, and I honestly don't remember how I was even really aware of it then. But I do remember I supported it.

You say that as if it were some kind of substantiated fact instead of unsubstantiated assertions (false propaganda).

It's pretty ironic that one can observe that the most regulated (least free market) industries in the country have the biggest problems in the country, problems logically impossible in a free market, then blame those problems on a lack of regulation (free market). Now that takes an efficient propaganda machine!

To paraphrase Reagan: "The trouble with Ivan Seeking isn't that he's wrong, it's that he knows so much that isn't so."

 

[drankin]

"If a man is not a socialist in his youth, he has no heart. If he is not a conservative by the time he is forty he has no head." - Georges Clemenceau

Now isn't this the truth!

When I was younger I was very much a liberal.

 

[turbo]

When I was young, (1960s) I was taken with conservative causes, much to the dismay of my father. By the time that Reagan took office, increased the size of government, and started engineering money-dumps to the upper class so we could get "trickeled on" I had gotten pretty disallusioned. I had to leave the GOP and work as an independent. I have no affiliation with either party. I have occasionally made strategic registrations (though not for at least 10 years) so that I could vote in primaries, but that's it.

I think that my progression is in contrast (if not contrary) to Clemenceau.

 

[Evo]

I've never sided with any type of thought. I always looked at which candidate could do the best job, was more likely to not be lying, etc... I never held any beliefs in any political camp, I still don't.

 

[Proton Soup]

"If a man is not a socialist in his youth, he has no heart. If he is not a conservative by the time he is forty he has no head." - Georges Clemenceau

it's complete crap. i was more or less apolitical in high school. time i hit college, Clinton was comes in office, and i became not so much republican as anti-democrat mostly because they just seem so irrational to my engineering brain. some time after that, i start reading Atlas Shrugged and become a Libertarian. and i think at the time, libertarianism appealed to my sense of reason and fairness and a belief that people were mostly rational. this comes about for a lot of reasons, not the least of which is that the young mind is much more black/white, right/wrong, good/evil. as you get older, the world starts looking a lot more grey. and you also realize that almost everyone is lying about something, especially the old farts up on capitol hill. and you realize that you're not indestructible, and that there is no John Galt, and you can't build utopias on your own.

i don't guess that sounds like it's going anywhere to most, so i'll just say that what happens by the time you're forty is that you're thinking about your pension. and keeping it depends on lots of things, not just how well you manage your finances. but also, how well you maintain allegiances to a system that keeps you from losing your nest egg. or, maybe to put it in more modern terms, your Medicare. suddenly, you're very conservative with your own money, and very liberal with everyone else's (is that the neoconservatism I've been hearing so much about?). i guess if your definition of conservative is becoming more selfish, then that may in fact be true.

guess it all depends on what you mean by liberal and conservative. I've always considered myself socially liberal. and I'm no longer sure i'd consider laissez-faire capitalism to be the only flavor of economic conservatism.

 

[CAC1001]

When I was young, (1960s) I was taken with conservative causes, much to the dismay of my father. By the time that Reagan took office, increased the size of government, and started engineering money-dumps to the upper class so we could get "trickeled on" I had gotten pretty disallusioned. I had to leave the GOP and work as an independent. I have no affiliation with either party. I have occasionally made strategic registrations (though not for at least 10 years) so that I could vote in primaries, but that's it.

I think that my progression is in contrast (if not contrary) to Clemenceau.

If your progression is contrary to Clemenceau (start conservative, move more leftist), then if you believe Reagan increased the size of government, he should have been your man!

I've never sided with any type of thought. I always looked at which candidate could do the best job, was more likely to not be lying, etc... I never held any beliefs in any political camp, I still don't.

Surely you must have certain beliefs you adhere to (pro-life versus pro-choice, bigger government versus more limited government, etc...)? Having certain beliefs doesn't mean one will fall into either political camp however.

 

[Pythagorean]

At what age did you become politically aware?
17.

What was the biggest influence on your worldview?
whiny teenage anti-authoritative angst; hippy movement (even though I was born in 80)

Did your morals and beliefs change over time?
yes. I became more cynical. I lost faith in politics really being about the greater good, I became a scientist. I don't really think we can change society at large. I think it's the bigger, tougher force and it will evolve exactly how it's going to evolve despite us kicking and screaming. I see the political field more like I see nature, now, I guess, and less like a civilized arena where my voice is significant.

Are their specific events, people, art, books, etc. that had a big influence on what you believe?
my science education and the science community at large.

Was there ever an issue or event that made you re-examine previously held views?
personal relationships; negative consequences of actions are good teachers. They don't really change my views, since my views aren't set, but they do influence my views. They change my behavior. My views are still developing alongside.

 

[Al68]

I lost faith in politics really being about the greater good...

Politics is about the use of force, not the greater good. Unless one's ideology equates the two such that they believe in using force to change society.

I don't really think we can change society at large.

Not without sacrificing our liberty. It can and has been done, but is not a part of a free society. A free society isn't changed by government, it's only protected by it from the aggressive force of others.

 

[WhoWee]

"If a man is not a socialist in his youth, he has no heart. If he is not a conservative by the time he is forty he has no head." - Georges Clemenceau

My teachers were VERY liberal between grades 7 - 10. Their constant chant was anti-war, pro-labor, anti-Government, pro-ACLU, pro-civil rights, pro-welfare, anti-Big Corps, pro-environment, and pro-Progressive. As a group, we respected our teachers and memorized the chant.

Unfortunately (?), we were living in a lost episode of the "Wonder Years" and the ideology didn't match the reality. While fully indoctrinated in the liberal ideology, I was never totally convinced.

In the 9th grade, I took a serious interest in current events and began to track national and international events - clipping and compiling news accounts.

In college, some of my friends swallowed the hard left ideology and became their most vocal spokespersons on campus. They pushed hard to sign the rest of us up for anti-(everything Government/defense/Big Corps) they could find. While they sold it as "cool" - I realized that really didn't agree - that we do need defense, that everyone should try to get a job, and that it was ok to want to make a good living. I wanted to buy cars and travel on airplanes.

While I continue to label myself an "Unrepresented Angry Independent" - I grow more Conservative with each year.

 

[Jasongreat]

I guess I was a late bloomer compared with others around here, I didnt really become politically aware until about 25 or so. I have been conservative for as long as I remember, I guess that was just par for the course growing up in one of the most conservative states in the union, and starting to work at the age of 12 and seeing my money being taken through taxes. I pretty much didnt care what was going on in washington or my localities, I just worked and played all I could. Then came Reagan, who I would say influenced me the most but not in the way you might think. I was stopped at a roadside checkpoint on labor day, and had my truck impounded for a month because I was driving with a suspended license, because of unpaid tickets. I was astounded that one could be stopped without probable cause, so I started researching and reading the pertinent USSC cases, that's where I came to realize that Reagan had implemented the unconstitutional searches, and when I read the opinion of Renquist, he basicly stated that he knew the searches were unconstitutional, but that he thought that the majority agreed and that he also felt that the founders would also have agreed. That was when I started my political journey. I read the writings of Jefferson, Franklin, Adams, Washington, Madison, the Federalist and anti-federalist papers, and many more and I didnt find one instance anywhere that led me to believe any of them would agree with the subversion of our rights in the name of safety or security. Adams himself had a son die from alchoholism and never did I ever read him say that booze needed to be banned or even regulated at the federal level. During my time reading those authors I kept seeing names being thrown around such as Bolingbroke, Locke, Bacon, Voltaire and others which led me to reading philosophy to see what they were all talking about. Which I enjoyed reading more than I would have ever suspected and those led me to others also of which I think Locke, Bacon, Marcus Aurelious, Epectitus, Voltaire and Nietzche have been my favorites, although I have yet to read bolingbroke, he will probably break into the top five, Jefferson seemed to like him and Jefferson is probably my favorite founder, well along with Franklin. I feel that my political beliefs have evolved from fairly conservative, to fairly libertarian, but I prefer to think of that as classical liberal(the original conservatives, in the US), liberty never can come from a bigger government, nor in the complete absense of government, imo. I definitely don't fall under the Republican or Democratic tents, since the republicans changed the US from a republic to a nation, and democrats have changed the US from a nation to a form of national socialism. All the changes have been adverse to individualism, freedom, and personal responsibility, three things I hold dear.

 

[Newai]

Ok, after posting answers to all these questions, while suffering a simply mis-key wiping out half an hour of work, I hope you understand why I post my basic idea, first, before filling in the rest within, say, half an hour's time...

GAH! It's so frustrating to lose half an hour's worth of work, and I feel like what I wind up salvaging is but a rusty replica of the original.

Fix your board! Please!

Gah... And please forgive me if I post this in increments, as I will NOT do this a third time.

Thanks.

CTRL+A CTRL+C every time you spend more than a few minutes on a post. (wink)

 

[Newai]

At what age did you become politically aware?
Late teens.

What was the biggest influence on your worldview?
Bullying. Republicans looked like bullies and Democrats looked like sissies or whiners. (All from the perspective of a teenager.)

Did your morals and beliefs change over time?
Once I got away from religion, changed quickly.

Are their specific events, people, art, books, etc. that had a big influence on what you believe?
Scientists in general. I'm sure there are some bad apples in the basket, but that's where most of my trust was steadily venturing.

Was there ever an issue or event that made you re-examine previously held views?
9/11.

 

[Char. Limit]

Here on physicsforums, there is a diverse range of political and moral belief. I am interested in the subject of how people form their political views.

At what age did you become politically aware?

About 14 or so. I remember that Bush was in office at the time.

What was the biggest influence on your worldview?

My parents, my local newspaper, and who was president when I grew up all influenced me some, but mostly it was my own ideas.

Did your morals and beliefs change over time?

There hasn't been enough time.

Are there specific events, people, art, books, etc. that had a big influence on what you believe?

FIFY. But seriously, I think it was the depression that occurred (in my eyes) under Republican rule that started me out politically. Then there was all this restriction of speech that just rubbed me the wrong way.

Was there ever an issue or event that made you re-examine previously held views?

When the Republicans started talking sense, I realized that I wasn't nearly as liberal as I thought I was.

 

[MECHster]

I am still young but I have changed my views on politics a couple of times.

At what age did you become politically aware?

Grade 8, so 13/14.

What was the biggest influence on your worldview?

Hmmm...In terms of actual events that I was alive to witness and think about at the time, 9/11 (Iraq War), the economic collapse of 2008, and the climate change issue.

Did your morals and beliefs change over time? Are their specific events, people, art, books, etc. that had a big influence on what you believe? Was there ever an issue or event that made you re-examine previously held views?

At first I tended to agree with Marxism and pure equality and all that. In high school I spent much time arguing with class mates and teachers about Marxism. I bought into the argument that everybody rowing in one direction would get to a Utopian world much quicker. I developed these thoughts primarily by hating the current system of government. However, I always mentioned that communism could only work if the people at the top were honest. I then read 1984 and A Brave New World, which drew me even further from the current direction of politics. During my last couple years of high school I wrote all my essays (English, law, philosophy and economics classes) on current political issues. Researching the Federal Reserve added to my view that the current government did not work, as well as my research into social engineering. Even in my communism phase I always held personal freedoms in high regard. I then started reading some of the fathers of America, Jefferson etc. After noticing the contrast from what the current USA is compared to their philosophy I realized that even if communism worked for the first couple leaders it would be near impossible to make sure the state was honest over a longer period of time. I then stumbled upon philosopher Stefan Molyneux and he convinced me that pure anarchism is what I really believed in all along. Some of the books(political) I read include; 1984, A Brave New World, Fight Club, The Creature from Jekyll Island, as well as a lot of stuff online.

 

[Pythagorean]

Not without sacrificing our liberty. It can and has been done, but is not a part of a free society. A free society isn't changed by government, it's only protected by it from the aggressive force of others.

In my view, the changes are inevitable emergence of global social climate. While one particular person and/or policy may be an instrument of social change, I believe the change would still have had to come without that particular person or policy.

But also that our actions often have unexpected consequences in such complex systems and large scale social experiments are very difficult to repeat. You're basically shaking the pinball machine and hoping for the best.