Thermodynamic Cycle 2: Understanding PV^y, Cp/Cv and PV=nRT

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Homework Help Overview

The discussion revolves around a thermodynamic cycle involving the relationships between pressure, volume, and temperature, specifically using the equations PV^y = constant, Cp/Cv, and PV=nRT. Participants are exploring how to relate different variables in the context of a thermodynamic process.

Discussion Character

  • Exploratory, Conceptual clarification, Mathematical reasoning, Problem interpretation

Approaches and Questions Raised

  • Participants discuss how to relate Vm and 4Vo using the PV^y = constant relation and attempt to derive equations involving P0, V0, Pm, and Vm. There are inquiries about calculating work done, heat transfer, and changes in internal energy, with some participants expressing uncertainty about the necessary variables.

Discussion Status

Some participants have provided guidance on approaching the problem algebraically and using the ideal gas law. There is ongoing exploration of the relationships between temperature, pressure, and volume, with various interpretations being discussed. No explicit consensus has been reached regarding the calculations or the values of certain variables.

Contextual Notes

Participants are working under constraints such as missing information about the number of moles and temperature changes, which are critical for applying the first law of thermodynamics effectively. The discussion reflects the complexities involved in thermodynamic calculations.

subzero0137
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2. PV^y = const, y=Cp/Cv, PV=nRT, 3.
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I've drawn the cycle for part a) of the question, but I'm not sure how to do part b). I know I need to relate Vm and 4Vo using the PV^y = constant relation but I'm stuck as to how to do it.
 
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subzero0137 said:
I know I need to relate Vm and 4Vo using the PV^y = constant relation
Using that, write an equation relating P0, V0, Pm and Vm.
 
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haruspex said:
Using that, write an equation relating P0, V0, Pm and Vm.

Thanks, I think I got it now. Just to confirm, would P_m = P_0/32?
 
subzero0137 said:
Thanks, I think I got it now. Just to confirm, would P_m = P_0/32?
Yes.
 
haruspex said:
Yes.

Sorry to bother you again but the next part of the questions asks to determine the work done, heat transfer and change in internal energy in each process. So if we consider the first, isobaric process then the work done on the gas is simply Won = -P0 * (4V0 - V0) = -P0 * 3V0. To calculate the heat transferred (Q) and change in internal energy (ΔU) I can use the first law of thermodynamics, but the equations for Q and ΔU involve variables that I don't know. ΔU=nCVΔT and Q=nCPΔT. I don't know how to get either Q or ΔU if I don't know n (moles) and change in temperature.
 
subzero0137 said:
Sorry to bother you again but the next part of the questions asks to determine the work done, heat transfer and change in internal energy in each process. So if we consider the first, isobaric process then the work done on the gas is simply Won = -P0 * (4V0 - V0) = -P0 * 3V0. To calculate the heat transferred (Q) and change in internal energy (ΔU) I can use the first law of thermodynamics, but the equations for Q and ΔU involve variables that I don't know. ΔU=nCVΔT and Q=nCPΔT. I don't know how to get either Q or ΔU if I don't know n (moles) and change in temperature.
Try it algebraically, also making use of the ideal gas law, and see how it plays out. I think you will be pleasantly surprised.
 
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Chestermiller said:
Do it "per mole."

ΔU=CVΔT and Q=CPΔT? But the temperature differences are still missing. I tried to do P0V0/T1 = P04V0/T2 ⇒ T2=4T1 but that doesn't give a change in temperature
 
$$nT_0=\frac{P_0V_0}{R}$$
$$nT_1=\frac{P_0(4V_0)}{R}$$
$$nC_v(T_1-T_0)=C_v\frac{3P_0V_0}{R}$$
For a monoatomic gas, what is the molar Cv in terms of R?
 
Chestermiller said:
$$nT_0=\frac{P_0V_0}{R}$$
$$nT_1=\frac{P_0(4V_0)}{R}$$
$$nC_v(T_1-T_0)=C_v\frac{3P_0V_0}{R}$$
For a monoatomic gas, what is the molar Cv in terms of R?

Molar Cv = 3/2 R? Sorry I'm still confused
 
Last edited:
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subzero0137 said:
Molar Cv = 3/2 R? Sorry I'm still confused
$$\Delta U=nC_v\Delta T=\left(\frac{3R}{2}\right)\frac{3P_0V_0}{R}=?$$
 
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