Trouble computing ∂^2 f/∂x^2 (1,1)

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Homework Help Overview

The discussion revolves around finding the second partial derivative ∂²f/∂x² for a function defined implicitly by the equation of a surface near the point (1,1,1). The surface is given by the equation x⁴ * y⁷ + y⁶ * z⁸ + z⁷ * x⁹ + 4xyz = 7, where z = f(x,y) is differentiable.

Discussion Character

  • Exploratory, Assumption checking, Problem interpretation

Approaches and Questions Raised

  • Participants discuss their attempts to compute the second derivative, with some expressing difficulty in isolating ∂f/∂x for further differentiation. There are mentions of implicit differentiation and substituting known values into derived expressions.

Discussion Status

Some participants have successfully computed the first derivatives but are struggling with the second derivative. There is a recognition of errors in initial differentiation attempts, and corrections are being shared. Multiple interpretations of the differentiation process are being explored.

Contextual Notes

Participants note discrepancies in their calculations and the importance of correctly applying differentiation rules. There is an emphasis on the complexity of the implicit differentiation involved in this problem.

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Homework Statement


Question:
"Given that the surface x^4 * y^7 + y^6 * z^8 + z^7 * x^9 + 4xyz = 7
has the equation z = f(x,y) in a neighborhood of the point (1,1,1) with f(x,y) differentiable, find the derivatives.

Find:
a) ∂f/∂x(1,1)
b) ∂f/∂y(1,1)
c) ∂^2 f/∂x^2"

Answers:
∂f/∂x(1,1) = -17/19 = -0.894736842105263
∂f/∂y(1,1) = -17/19 = -0.894736842105263
∂^2 f/∂x^2 (1,1) = -2.2399766729844


Homework Equations


Just taking the derivative of
4x^3 * y^7 + 9x^8 * z^7 + 4yz + ∂f/∂x(8z^7 * y^6 + 7z^6 + 4yz).
I also know that ∂f/∂x(1,1) = -17/19.


The Attempt at a Solution


I successfully get every single part of this question except the ∂^2 f/∂x^2 part.

Instead of isolating for ∂f/∂x and trying to differentiate that again with respect to x (which seems very difficult, if not impossible, to do by hand), I just implicitly differentiate for the second time treating ∂f/∂x as a function. I then just plug in -17/19 for ∂f/∂x(1,1) and plug in the point (1,1,1) and get the wrong answer. I tried computing ∂^2 f/∂x^2 several times and keep getting it wrong so any help would be greatly appreciated.

Thanks in advance!
 

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s3a said:

Homework Statement


Question:
"Given that the surface x^4 * y^7 + y^6 * z^8 + z^7 * x^9 + 4xyz = 7
has the equation z = f(x,y) in a neighborhood of the point (1,1,1) with f(x,y) differentiable, find the derivatives.

Find:
a) ∂f/∂x(1,1)
b) ∂f/∂y(1,1)
c) ∂^2 f/∂x^2"

Answers:
∂f/∂x(1,1) = -17/19 = -0.894736842105263
∂f/∂y(1,1) = -17/19 = -0.894736842105263
∂^2 f/∂x^2 (1,1) = -2.2399766729844


Homework Equations


Just taking the derivative of
4x^3 * y^7 + 9x^8 * z^7 + 4yz + ∂f/∂x(8z^7 * y^6 + 7z^6 + 4yz).
I also know that ∂f/∂x(1,1) = -17/19.


The Attempt at a Solution


I successfully get every single part of this question except the ∂^2 f/∂x^2 part.

Instead of isolating for ∂f/∂x and trying to differentiate that again with respect to x (which seems very difficult, if not impossible, to do by hand), I just implicitly differentiate for the second time treating ∂f/∂x as a function. I then just plug in -17/19 for ∂f/∂x(1,1) and plug in the point (1,1,1) and get the wrong answer. I tried computing ∂^2 f/∂x^2 several times and keep getting it wrong so any help would be greatly appreciated.

Thanks in advance!
Here's the Latex of the equation of the surface: [itex]x^4 \, y^7 + y^6 \, z^8 + z^7 \, x^9 + 4xyz = 7[/itex]

Here's Latex for your result for the first partial derivative:
[itex]\displaystyle <br /> 4x^3 \, y^7 + 9x^8 \, z^7 + 4yz + \frac{\partial f}{\partial x}(8z^7 \, y^6 + 7z^6 + 4yz)=0[/itex]​

I got something different:
[itex]\displaystyle <br /> 4x^3 \, y^7 + 9x^8 \, z^7 + 4yz + \frac{\partial f}{\partial x}(8z^7 \, y^6 + 7z^6\,x^9 + 4yz)=0[/itex]

Here's the image of your work, so it's easier to check out.
attachment.php?attachmentid=44347&d=1330124781.jpg


That's a correct method.
 
I kept getting it wrong so many times but I finally got it right. What I had shown here is wrong for the first differentiation with respect to x and so was yours.

Here is my work if you can read the handwriting and care.

Thank you!
 

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s3a said:
I kept getting it wrong so many times but I finally got it right. What I had shown here is wrong for the first differentiation with respect to x and so was yours.

Here is my work if you can read the handwriting and care.

Thank you!
It took me a long time to see what I had wrong.

Should be 4xy, not 4yz in the parentheses.

Here's the corrected first derivative.

[itex]\displaystyle <br /> 4x^3 \, y^7 + 9x^8 \, z^7 + 4yz + \frac{\partial f}{\partial x}(8z^7 \, y^6 + 7z^6\,x^9 + 4xy)=0[/itex]
 
Yeah, I saw it. :smile: Also, sorry, I should have told you and spared your wasteful search.
 

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