Uniform Circular Motion, Find the Tension

AI Thread Summary
The discussion focuses on calculating the tension in a rope used to spin a child on a cart while on a conical hill. The initial calculations led to incorrect tension values, prompting the user to seek clarification on the forces involved. Key points include the need to correctly account for centripetal acceleration and the components of tension, particularly how they relate to weight and normal force. The user successfully amended their approach after receiving guidance, ultimately leading to a correct understanding of the problem. The thread concludes with the user expressing gratitude for the assistance received.
Hoophy
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IMPORTANT!
TEXT IN GREEN HAS BEEN ADDED AND IS CORRECT
TEXT IN RED HAS BEEN REMOVED AND IS INCORRECT

1. Homework Statement

Question: An energetic father stands at the summit of a conical hill as he spins his 25 kg child around on a 5.7 kg cart with a 2.3-m-long rope.
The sides of the hill are inclined at 22∘.
He keeps the rope parallel to the ground, and friction is negligible.
What rope tension will allow the cart to spin with the 16 rpm

Homework Equations


My variables and constants:
Child Mass = mchild = 25 kg
Cart Mass = mcart = 5.7 kg
Rope Length = L = 2.3 m
Radius = r = Lcos(22∘) = 2.3 m
Hill Grade = θ = 22∘
Angular Velocity = ω = 16 rpm = 1.67551608 rad/s
Tension = T
Total Mass = m = mchild + mcart
Centripetal Acceleration = ac
g = 9.8 m/s2
Weight = w = mg

The Attempt at a Solution


a) I drew a free body diagram with
1) Tension pointing North-West (up the slope and parallel to the surface)
2) Normal Force pointing North-East (perpendicular to the surface)
3) Weight pointing down
b) I defined my coordinate system as:
1) Positive x is up the slope and parallel to the surface
2) Positive y is parallel with the Normal Force and perpendicular to the surface (pointing away from the ground, into the sky)
hillcart.PNG

c) I summed the forces in the x axis:
Fx: mac*cos(θ) = T - mg*sin(θ)
d) I isolated Tension:
T = mac*cos(θ) + mg*sin(θ)
e) I found ac:
ac = ω2r
f) I substituted ac into my equation from (d):
T = mω2r*cos(θ) + mg*sin(θ)
!) T = mω2(L*cos(θ))*cos(θ) + mg*sin(θ)
g) I plugged in known values:
T = (25 kg + 5.7 kg)(1.67551608 rad/s)2(2.3 m) + (25 kg + 5.7 kg)(9.8 m/s2)*sin(22∘)
T = (25 kg + 5.7 kg)(1.67551608 rad/s)2((2.3 m)*cos(22∘))*cos(22∘) + (25 kg + 5.7 kg)(9.8 m/s2)*sin(22∘)
h) I computed Tension as T = 310.928 N = 310 N
T = 283.111 N = 280 N

4. A note
310 N is not the correct answer, nor is 310.928 N. Also I do not know what the correct answer is...
I was wondering if someone could help me figure out what it is that I am doing incorrectly?

I really appreciate the help, thanks in advance!
Thank you so much for helping me with this problem @TSny! :smile:
 

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It would be helpful if you could post a diagram.
Hoophy said:
c) I summed the forces in the x axis:
Fx: mac = T - mg*sin(θ)

Does the cart move on a horizontal circle? If so, would the centripetal acceleration be parallel to your x-axis which is along the slope?
 
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TSny said:
It would be helpful if you could post a diagram.Does the cart move on a horizontal circle? If so, would the centripetal acceleration be parallel to your x-axis which is along the slope?
I have edited my post to include a drawing.

I see...
So would I need to do:
Fx: maccos(θ) = T - mg*sin(θ) ?
Thanks. :smile:
 
Hoophy said:
I have edited my post to include a drawing.

I see...
So would I need to do:
Fx: maccos(θ) = T - mg*sin(θ) ?
Thanks. :smile:
Yes. Looks good.

Does r equal the length of the rope?
 
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Yes. Looks good.

Does r equal the length of the rope?
Would I be able to replace all previous instances of "r" with (Rope_Length)cos(θ) ?
 
Hoophy said:
Would I be able to replace all previous instances of "r" with (Rope_Length)cos(θ) ?
Sounds right
 
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It may help if you consider the components of the tension. All of the tension in the rope does not account for the centripetal acceleration.
One component of the tension counters the weight, which in turn could affect the normal force. What new set of equations would you end up with if you introduce components of the tension?
 
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TSny said:
Sounds right
That did the trick, thank you so much for all of your help!

I have amended my post with the correct process in case anyone with a similar question stumbles upon this thread.
 
Hoophy said:
That did the trick, thank you so much for all of your help!

I have amended my post with the correct process in case anyone with a similar question stumbles upon this thread.
Good work
 
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