What is the maximum depth to which a P-wave ray can travel?

Click For Summary

Homework Help Overview

The discussion revolves around the maximum depth to which a P-wave ray can travel, focusing on shock wave propagation in the Earth's crust. Participants are examining calculations related to P-wave velocities and their relationship to depth, using a model that includes various parameters and equations.

Discussion Character

  • Exploratory, Conceptual clarification, Mathematical reasoning, Assumption checking

Approaches and Questions Raised

  • Participants are attempting to calculate P-wave velocities and their corresponding depths using a spreadsheet model. There are questions about the meaning and units of variables, the relevance of certain parameters, and the interpretation of results. Some participants express confusion regarding the calculations and seek clarification on specific terms and values.

Discussion Status

Guidance has been offered regarding the interpretation of the data and the significance of certain values. Participants are exploring multiple interpretations of the results, particularly concerning the behavior of P-waves at varying depths and velocities. There is an ongoing dialogue about the implications of velocity changes and how they affect wave propagation.

Contextual Notes

Some participants have noted the constraints of the task, including the requirement to use specific tables and values provided. There is also mention of potential errors in calculations and the need for clearer definitions of variables used in the equations.

peeballs
Messages
13
Reaction score
0
Homework Statement
For a spherical Earth (see Table 1 for velocity and depth, linear gradient),
what is the maximum depth a P-wave ray with p = 0:05 can travel to? If we
increase the ray parameter to p = 0:055 or p = 0:06, what are the maximum
depths these rays can travel to?
Relevant Equations
zf = -a*ln(r/a), (r/a)*vf = (a/r)*vs(r), 20/6371 = (vs/r)
I've created an excel spreadsheet with the given model in addition to calculating radius of the layer by subtracting depth from 6371. I've calculated Zf.

I've also found what I think is vs by doing alpha * (radius column/6371), but that could be wrong. I know I need to find where 20/6371 = Vs/r, but I think I made a mistake along the way because my solution doesn't include any answers that work.
 

Attachments

  • Screenshot_27.png
    Screenshot_27.png
    24.7 KB · Views: 230
  • Screenshot_28.png
    Screenshot_28.png
    67.9 KB · Views: 213
Physics news on Phys.org
HI,

Could you be a bit more complete ? Some explanation of meaning and units with the variables, which ones are known, which equations you use to calculate which unknowns, etc. etc.

Legibility can be improved if you use ##\alpha## instead of a, make use of subscripts, etc. etc.

Why doesn't p occur in your equations ?

This is about shock wave propagation in Earth's crust ?
 
BvU said:
HI,

Could you be a bit more complete ? Some explanation of meaning and units with the variables, which ones are known, which equations you use to calculate which unknowns, etc. etc.

Legibility can be improved if you use ##\alpha## instead of a, make use of subscripts, etc. etc.

Why doesn't p occur in your equations ?

This is about shock wave propagation in Earth's crust ?
@BvU Here's another screengrab of the spreadsheet with more detailed units and formulas. Still confused. I don't use p because 1/p (i.e., velocity) is the relevant value I need - 1/p is the value I am trying to find depth for.
 

Attachments

  • Screenshot_29.png
    Screenshot_29.png
    44.6 KB · Views: 206
peeballs said:
@BvU Here's another screengrab of the spreadsheet with more detailed units and formulas. Still confused. I don't use p because 1/p (i.e., velocity) is the relevant value I need - 1/p is the value I am trying to find depth for.
What is meant by α?
Table 1 merits some explanation. Why do some depths occur twice, and some alpha values occur twice, but staggered?
What does p=0:05 mean? Do you mean 0.05, and would that mean the velocity at max depth is 20km/s? I don't see any alpha values that high.
 
@haruspex
alpha is the p-wave velocity in km/s.

Some depths and velocities occur twice because they're the depths to the layer and the thickness of layers can be reoccurring, and since the velocities of p-waves in these layers depends on many factors, they may repeat as well. Table 1 is non-negotiable as it's given as part of the task.

The turning point (value I'm told to find) is where 1/v = 0.05 - so yes, the spherical velocity of the max depth is 20 km/s. I'm assuming that means I did the conversion wrong somewhere, which I'm asking about. I don't know where, though.
 
peeballs said:
@haruspex
alpha is the p-wave velocity in km/s.

Some depths and velocities occur twice because they're the depths to the layer and the thickness of layers can be reoccurring, and since the velocities of p-waves in these layers depends on many factors, they may repeat as well. Table 1 is non-negotiable as it's given as part of the task.

The turning point (value I'm told to find) is where 1/v = 0.05 - so yes, the spherical velocity of the max depth is 20 km/s. I'm assuming that means I did the conversion wrong somewhere, which I'm asking about. I don't know where, though.
I think the key item in the table is the last one. Note how the velocity drops. You know why that is, right? What will happen to a wave that gets that far?
 
haruspex said:
I think the key item in the table is the last one. Note how the velocity drops. You know why that is, right? What will happen to a wave that gets that far?
@haruspex once it slows down enough won't it just turn around? It still doesn't help me find the equivalent spherical depth where that occurs
 
peeballs said:
@haruspex once it slows down enough won't it just turn around? It still doesn't help me find the equivalent spherical depth where that occurs
You have it backward. Waves tend to curve back towards the surface because the velocity mostly increases with depth.
Think of a light ray through glass. Total internal reflection occurs because the light is slower in glass than in air.
Reaching a place where the P wave velocity is lower is not going to cause reflection. So what will happen?
 

Similar threads

  • · Replies 10 ·
Replies
10
Views
4K
  • · Replies 3 ·
Replies
3
Views
3K
  • · Replies 1 ·
Replies
1
Views
3K
Replies
4
Views
4K
  • · Replies 11 ·
Replies
11
Views
4K
  • · Replies 15 ·
Replies
15
Views
6K