What is the Meaning of P(E given F) in Basic Probability?

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Discussion Overview

The discussion centers on understanding the concept of conditional probability, specifically the meaning of P(E given F) in the context of basic probability theory. Participants explore the implications of this concept through examples and visual aids, such as Venn diagrams, while seeking clarity on procedural aspects and foundational principles.

Discussion Character

  • Exploratory
  • Conceptual clarification
  • Debate/contested
  • Mathematical reasoning

Main Points Raised

  • One participant expresses confusion regarding the meaning of "E given F," questioning if it refers to the probability of E occurring if F occurs, and its relevance.
  • Another participant suggests using a Venn diagram to visualize the relationship between events E, F, and G, explaining that P(E given F) represents the area of E that overlaps with F divided by the area of F.
  • A follow-up question arises about whether P(F) and P(G) summing to 1 is due to the nature of F and G being mutually exclusive and collectively exhaustive events.
  • Participants discuss the dependency of E on F and G, with one participant affirming that the description finds the probability of E based on the outcomes of F or G.
  • There is a request for terminology related to this type of probability problem, with a suggestion that they might be referred to as strict dichotomies.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants generally agree on the interpretation of P(E given F) and the relationship between events F and G, but there remains some uncertainty regarding the terminology and broader implications of these concepts.

Contextual Notes

Participants mention foundational principles of probability, such as the mutual exclusivity of events F and G, but do not resolve the deeper implications or definitions surrounding conditional probability.

Who May Find This Useful

This discussion may be useful for individuals seeking to understand basic concepts of probability, particularly those grappling with conditional probabilities and their applications in various contexts.

Redd
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I have never been very good at probability, and I am confused with this rather simple statement:

"BASIC FACT:
Let E be any event, and F and G be events such that one and only one of the events F and G will occur. Then

P(E) = P(F)*P(E given F) + P(G)*P(E given G)"

Where P(E) = the probability of E occurring. And the same for the others.

To be honest I don't even understand what it is asking me to do procedurally. What does it mean "E given F"? Is that the probability of E occurring if F occurs? Why is that pertinent? More than that I don't understand the reasoning nor do I have any intuitive inkling as to why this expression would yield the correct answer.
Can someone give an example perhaps?
(The book I was given just assumes the reader automatically understands this property).

Any help would be greatly appreciated.
 
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The best way to understand it is by using a Venn diagram. The descriptions of F and G are such that they don't overlap and together fill the entire event space. Place E on the diagram and you see that part of it may overlap F while the rest would overlap G.

To add things up properly, P(E given F) means the area of the part of E overlapping F divided by the area of F. Similarly for P(E given G). To get the E area, multiply each piece by the area of F or G as needed.
 
mathman said:
The best way to understand it is by using a Venn diagram. The descriptions of F and G are such that they don't overlap and together fill the entire event space. Place E on the diagram and you see that part of it may overlap F while the rest would overlap G.

To add things up properly, P(E given F) means the area of the part of E overlapping F divided by the area of F. Similarly for P(E given G). To get the E area, multiply each piece by the area of F or G as needed.

Okay. I still have a couple questions.
If P(F) and P(G) fill the "entire event space" does that mean P(F) + P(G) always = 1?
And is that just because one and only one of the events must occur?
That seems to make sense.
So E is dependent on F and G, and this description is finding the probability of E as it depends on the outcomes of F or G?
I hope I'm not misunderstanding because it seems to fit now.

On a side note, do you know if there is a name for this sort of thing so that I can look into it more, or should I just look into general probability basics?
Thanks :)
 
Redd said:
Okay. I still have a couple questions.
If P(F) and P(G) fill the "entire event space" does that mean P(F) + P(G) always = 1?

Yes

So E is dependent on F and G, and this description is finding the probability of E as it depends on the outcomes of F or G?

P(F v G)=1; P(F^G)= 0; P(F) = 1 - P(G); P(G)= 1 - P(F).
On a side note, do you know if there is a name for this sort of thing so that I can look into it more, or should I just look into general probability basics?

These types of problems are about the most basic probability examples, such as coin tosses with fair or biased coins. I guess you could call them strict dichotomies.
 
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