Working out freq for circuit to be in phase

  • Context: Engineering 
  • Thread starter Thread starter craka
  • Start date Start date
  • Tags Tags
    Circuit Phase
Click For Summary

Discussion Overview

The discussion revolves around calculating the frequency required for an AC circuit to achieve current and voltage in phase. The circuit consists of two parallel branches with resistors and inductors, and participants explore the implications of impedance on phase relationships.

Discussion Character

  • Homework-related
  • Mathematical reasoning
  • Technical explanation
  • Exploratory

Main Points Raised

  • One participant describes an AC circuit with specific impedances and a reference voltage, seeking to determine the frequency for in-phase conditions.
  • Another participant states that for voltage and current to be in phase, the impedance must be purely resistive, implying the imaginary part must be zero.
  • There is a request for clarification on how to express the impedances as functions of frequency, resistance, and inductance/capacitance.
  • A participant provides a formula for Z1 and Z2, indicating how to incorporate frequency into the impedance calculations.
  • Further inquiries are made about the expression for the parallel impedance Z1//Z2 using the previously defined Z1 and Z2.
  • Another participant attempts to derive the expression for Z1//Z2 but expresses confusion about the next steps in the calculation.
  • Assistance is requested to simplify the complex fraction involving Z1 and Z2, with a suggestion to equate the imaginary part of the numerator to zero to find the frequency.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants generally agree on the need for the imaginary part of the total impedance to be zero for the circuit to achieve in-phase conditions. However, there is no consensus on the specific steps to derive the necessary frequency, as participants express confusion and seek further clarification.

Contextual Notes

Some participants have made assumptions about the values of inductance and capacitance without providing specific numerical values. The discussion also reflects uncertainty regarding the correct formulation of the impedance equations and the steps to isolate frequency.

craka
Messages
19
Reaction score
0

Homework Statement



AC circuit Vs is 100V 50Hz and is used as reference.
there are two impedences in parallel, made up of a 5ohm resistor and an inductor reactance = +j2 ohm that is parallel with 3 ohm resistor and a inductor reactance = -j3 ohm (though I though negative imaginary part was for capactance?)

voltage across the 3 ohm resistor is 45 Volts

The branch with the resistor and inductor is called I1 , branch with resistor and capacitor is I2
Is is the total current from supply before the parallel branch.

Please see attachment of circuit

Homework Equations



I2 = v/I angle = arctan x/r

Is = Vs/Zt = Vs * 1/ (Z1 parallel Z2) = Z1Z2/(Z1+Z2)

The Attempt at a Solution



I2 = 45/3 =15A angle = artan -3/3 = -45 degrees

magnitude of Vs = 15 * sqrt(3^2+3^2) = 63.64 volts

Z1 = 5+2j = 5.385 angle 21.8 deg Z2 = 3-3j = 4.234 angle -45 deg

Z1//Z2 = {(5.385 angle 21.8) * ( 4.234 angle -45)}/ {(5+2j)+(3-3j)}

Z1//Z2 = 22.849 angle -23.2 deg / 8.06 angle -7.125

Z1//Z2 = 2.835 angle -16.075 deg

Is = 63.64/(2.835 angle -16.075) = 22.45 angle -16.08 degFrom here is where I'm lost on how to calculate the frequency needed to get this circuit to have current and voltage in phase (zero degrees)
 

Attachments

  • question_freq_inphase.jpg
    question_freq_inphase.jpg
    7.7 KB · Views: 434
Physics news on Phys.org
For voltage and current to be in phase, the impedance must be a pure resistance, so the imaginary part of your impedance must be zero.
Since you know the impedances of capacitor and inductor at 50Hz, you can calculate their values.
Write Z1, Z2 and Z1//Z2 as functions of the known values of resistances, inductances and capacitances and the unknown value of frequency. Then calculate the frequency for which the imaginary part of the impedance is zero.
 
I had worked out the inductance values of components for the known frequency of 50Hz howerver I'm unsure what you mean by "write Z1, Z2 and Z1//Z2 as functions of the known values of resistance, and inductance capacitance and the unknonwn value of frequency".
 
craka said:
I had worked out the inductance values of components for the known frequency of 50Hz howerver I'm unsure what you mean by "write Z1, Z2 and Z1//Z2 as functions of the known values of resistance, and inductance capacitance and the unknonwn value of frequency".

If you call f the frequency, Z_1=R_1 + 2\pi f L_1.
You have a similar expression for Z_2 and for the parallel of the two. The only unknown is f, that you calculate by making the imaginary part of the impedance equal to zero.
 
So I have Z1 = 5 + 2pifL and Z2 = 3 + 2pifl but what is the expression for Z1//Z2 with using the above value of Z1 and Z2 ??
 
craka said:
So I have Z1 = 5 + 2pifL and Z2 = 3 + 2pifl but what is the expression for Z1//Z2 with using the above value of Z1 and Z2 ??

No,
Z_1 = 5 +j2\pi f L
Z_2 = 3+\frac{1}{j2\pi f C}

and
Z_1 // Z_2 = \frac{Z_1 Z_2}{Z_1 + Z_2}
 
from that i get this

<br /> \begin{array}{l}<br /> z_1 //z_2 = \frac{{(5 + j2\pi fL) \times (3 + j\frac{1}{{2\pi fC}})}}{{(5 + j2\pi fL) + (3 + j\frac{1}{{2\pi fC}})}} \\ <br /> = \frac{{15 + j\frac{5}{{2\pi fC}} + j6\pi fL + \frac{L}{C}}}{{8 + j2\pi fL + j\frac{1}{{2\pi fC}}}} \\ <br /> \end{array}<br />
Again I'm stuck. Could you please give me some more assistance thankyou.
 
Last edited:
craka said:
from that i get this

<br /> \begin{array}{l}<br /> z_1 //z_2 = \frac{{(5 + j2\pi fL) \times (3 + j\frac{1}{{2\pi fC}})}}{{(5 + j2\pi fL) + (3 + j\frac{1}{{2\pi fC}})}} \\ <br /> = \frac{{15 + j\frac{5}{{2\pi fC}} + j6\pi fL + \frac{L}{C}}}{{8 + j2\pi fL + j\frac{1}{{2\pi fC}}}} \\ <br /> \end{array}<br />
Again I'm stuck. Could you please give me some more assistance thankyou.

Multiply the numerator and denominator of the fraction by the complex conjugate of the denominator. In this way only the numerator will be complex.
Equate the imaginary part of the numerator to zero and calculate the value of f.
 

Similar threads

  • · Replies 26 ·
Replies
26
Views
3K
  • · Replies 2 ·
Replies
2
Views
2K
  • · Replies 3 ·
Replies
3
Views
3K
  • · Replies 28 ·
Replies
28
Views
7K
  • · Replies 4 ·
Replies
4
Views
2K
  • · Replies 1 ·
Replies
1
Views
3K
  • · Replies 4 ·
Replies
4
Views
4K
  • · Replies 22 ·
Replies
22
Views
3K
  • · Replies 1 ·
Replies
1
Views
2K
  • · Replies 11 ·
Replies
11
Views
6K