An independent Physics study, group for all levels

[studious]

There are a wealth of resources... videos, texts, libraries, etc. that are available to us in our studies in physics. Even Physics Forums sections devoted to compiling lists of such resources!

For the sake of pacing, discipline, and other reasons (guidance?), who else would be interested in studying (introductory-advanced, "constructionist", axiomatic?) Classical Mechanics, Electrodynamics, and/or Quantum Mechanics at the upper level undergrad and early graduate level?

Essentially we will create a comprehensive syllabus modeled on the courses taught at some universities (MIT OCW, Stanford, IIT). Choose the appropriate sections from appropriate texts, etc. And follow it more or less independently with the entire group setting the pace.

This may be well-suited for interested students at all levels, mathematicians, philosophers, enthusiasts, stay-at-homers, and whoever.

I'm sure something like this is happening constantly in a variety of settings and for however long such forum sites as Physics Forums have existed.

But I hope this will be an entirely new group for a fresh group of well-intentioned learners.

If you are interested, or have favourable suggestions, please reply to this topic or recommend it to others.

 

[Geekchick]

I think this is a nice idea. I have been meaning to work through my "university Physics" text for the last few months ( I have been to busy with my actual classes to work on it) I plan on working through it this summer anyway.

However, I don't see what you actually intend to achieve by having a specific group put together when there are already ways of using this site to help with independent studying (homework section). We would have to be working through the same text and at the same pace to get any real additional benefits I would think.

 

[studious]

You are right in that many resources exist for independent study. But a group of similar minded students have these added benefits:

1. Pace... the curriculum we would adhere to. This is extremely useful for those who just don't have the "time."
2. Common problem sets... comprehensive simple to challenging sets of problems (after all, no sane person should really have to do every problem in Griffiths!... that is somewhat inefficient)
3. A way to help/re-explain challenging material to fellow students (this purpose is already somewhat fulfilled by Physics Forums, but a smaller group means fewer restrictions on what to ask, and greater way to "group-grok" various subjects within physics).
4. A sense of camaraderie...

It is not necessarily true that we stick to a single textbook. So long as we have a single curriculum with a stress on all the major theories, modes of thought, and mathematical machinery, we would transcend any single textbook.

But the pace you mentioned is somewhat important. Even if some of us will "lag" and others will "hasten," so long as the curriculum's pace itself is maintained, we would all "finish" (which is vastly more important than how fast we finish).

A canonical well-rounded education is what I am personally seeking. I hope to join those who think similarly and want to understand physics as comprehensively.

 

[dx]

I'm interested in doing this. I was actually planning to work through Landau's Quantum Mechanics on my own, but doing it with other people would be a lot more fun. Is anyone interested?

 

[studious]

I hear Landau/Lifschitz is a great option of course. They in fact wrote an entire series in Russian, which was translated into English.

(vol 2 or was it vol 3 which was quantum?).

 

[dx]

It's volume 3.

 

[yoyo100]

I think this is a fairly good idea. I'd like to know if anyone would be interested in doing this for mathematical topics as well?

 

[Geekchick]

math would be good. Out of curiosity what level is everyone at in physics and math? I have never taken physics so I am an absolute beginner there but I am finishing up calculus, DE, and LA. I am thinking about working on complex analysis over the summer.

 

[ahmadmz]

I am interested in this as well. I am currently studying Physics 1 on my own. Few months ago I learned some basic calculus on my own. It would be great to study calculus and mechanics (intro) in this kind of setting with other people.

 

[Vanadium 50]

I hear Landau/Lifschitz is a great option of course.

This is where this idea is going to come into trouble. Landau's books are outstanding - but I wouldn't try to learn from them the first time. They are almost unbelievably terse - it's not uncommon for him to skip steps which take many, many pages of calculations. By not having a professor, you miss two things - one is the guidance through these spots, and the other is the experience in text selection to avoid (or at least supplement) books like Landau for the first upper-division course.

 

[dx]

This is where this idea is going to come into trouble. Landau's books are outstanding - but I wouldn't try to learn from them the first time. They are almost unbelievably terse - it's not uncommon for him to skip steps which take many, many pages of calculations. By not having a professor, you miss two things - one is the guidance through these spots, and the other is the experience in text selection to avoid (or at least supplement) books like Landau for the first upper-division course.

The OP said "upper undergrad and beginning grad level" so I assumed this was not a first encounter with real QM. I've already had two courses in QM, and I've read many sections of Landau and I find it very accessible.

 

[studious]

As dx mentioned, I must clarify that this project is meant to be more 'in depth' (mathematically, conceptually, etc.) than an "introductory" class.

This requires a significant amount of mathematical maturity (filling in the blanks on paper vs. "seeing" all the steps) and motivation - both of which can be developed over time and cooperation.

(I've come to believe - I may be wrong about this - that mathematical maturity is more closely associated with psychological 'confidence' with the material than an intrinsic Will-Hunting-esque sense.)

 

[Jacobpm64]

I am always interested in self-studying things. However, I am kind of worried about the "pace" issue. I know that, at least for myself, time would be something that comes and leaves randomly. I'm a senior mathematics major, and my workloads are sometimes heavy and sometimes not as bad.

Anyway, with that said, I'd be willing to do this as best I could with either math or physics.

In math, I have single-variable and multivariable calculus, linear algebra, one semester of abstract algebra (rings and fields), logic, geometry, odes, pdes, and I'm enrolled in real analysis right now. I also have a little experience with difference equations and probability.

As far as physics goes, I have taken a semester in general calculus-based physics (introductory mechanics), and I'm currently in a second semester of general calculus-based physics (electromagnetism). I am also enrolled in an astronomy class. I've previously taken a course in thermodynamics/physical chemistry as well.

Anyway, that's where i stand, and I'm usually interested in learning anything if i have some free time.

 

[studious]

Perhaps if we recruit a few more members, we can decide on a syllabus an get started. Right now, we have interest in Classical Mechanics, (Electrodynamics?), Quantum Mechanics, and some math.

 

[glen37]

I have an interest in classical mathematics and math more than quantum mechanics but I'd be down for anything.

 

[Dr Transport]

...I'd like to know if anyone would be interested in doing this for mathematical topics as well?

Stay away from mathematical topics by themselves, introduce the math needed for a subject as you get to it...

 

[roeb]

Interesting, I would be interested in learning quantum mechanics and advanced electrodynamics (in addition to improving my linear algebra and diff eq skills). But it would have to wait until summer.

 

[Troponin]

I think this is a fairly good idea. I'd like to know if anyone would be interested in doing this for mathematical topics as well?

I'm up for math, definitely

 

[Troponin]

What about the "syllabus" allowing for more work over regular university breaks, eg: Christmas break, summer, etc.

I'm very interested in this, but it will be tough to fit the extra time in during regular school times.

 

[Jacobpm64]

I think Troponin has a great idea. We could possibly make a lighter load during school semesters and make heavier loads during breaks (if of course we all have the same breaks!)

 

[studious]

Of course, everyone will be very busy during the school terms. Perhaps we can make a curriculum built on snippets during the semester and a hard core one for summer breaks.

 

[Jacobpm64]

I'm definitely up for this. If I get into an REU this summer, I may not have much time to be hardcore. However, if I do not. I will be as hardcore about this as I can.

Anyway, regardless, it sounds like a good idea to me.

 

[Mubeen A]

i'm interested. i think this is a great idea!

 

[Troponin]

Seems like there is at least enough interest to keep a syllabus going for a "semester" with the expected drop outs and in-and-outs.

What's the next step on this?
I don't know who wants to set up the syllabus (the OP?)

I know I have some subjects I'd like to get a jump on as well as subjects I'd be interested in re-learning with the variations this group may provide.

Should we get a list of potential courses together?

 

[Jacobpm64]

yup.. someone will have to take action soon!

 

[studious]

All right, we can refine what specifically people are interested in within mathematics... unless we would like to resolve the mathematical machinery as we go along in each of the physics subjects.

 

[Jacobpm64]

well, I'm interested in either math or physics.. Math i have a lot more background.. as I'm a senior mathematics major right now.

Physics, I'm going for a physics minor--most of which will be taken next year. I only have the basic calculus-based two semesters of physics (mechanics and E&M).

Anything is good for me.. i love just learning.

 

[Unknot]

I can suggest something for math, but if you want physics, I suppose some kind expert on this forum will have to step up

 

[Troponin]

I can suggest something for math, but if you want physics, I suppose some kind expert on this forum will have to step up

Suggest away! I'm game for math.

 

[Unknot]

I (carefully) suggest that everyone has to be on the same page. Calculus, linear algebra, and ODE are probably required for anything. Will you be able to agree on something beyond that (like analysis)? I am not too sure.

 

[exdeoscientia]

Hello everyone,

I'm new to this forum, but I'm very interested in the idea of a study group for more advanced physics topics. I'm an undergrad physics and mathematics major and I have already independently read several books concerning quantum mechanics and modern physics in general. I'm a hard worker and am able to sufficiently teach myself difficult concepts, so please let me know what I need to do to be involved! Thanks.

 

[maze]

I'm interested in doing this. I was actually planning to work through Landau's Quantum Mechanics on my own, but doing it with other people would be a lot more fun. Is anyone interested?

I'm definitely interested in this.

 

[dx]

I'm definitely interested in this.

Hi maze,

What's your background?

 

[maze]

Hi maze,

What's your background?

Hi. Background is (applied) mathematics. I took introductory quantum mechanics as an undergrad.

 

[jdougherty]

Hey everyone,

I'm rather new as well, but I joined PF for this sort of thing, so I'm all for it. This week I'll be completing the coursework for an undergrad physics degree (we're on quarters), and I've spent a lot of time doing independent math study as well. I'd be up for anything, topic-wise. Particular suggestions:

Classical mechanics differential-geometry style (i.e. on manifolds - cf. http://math.ucr.edu/home/baez/classical/)
QFT? I've done a lot of quantum, and I've studied Hilbert spaces so much that I can do almost anything with them in my sleep. I've got a couple of "courses in topological qft" that people have put up on the arXiv that are aimed at advanced undergrads
Relativity? I find that things like this are often easier to attack with a group

So yeah, that's my 2 cents. I'd really be up for anything, though, even if I've done it before. I never get tired of doing physics-y things.

 

[windsupernova]

I'm pretty interested in this. I've recently joined PF, I'm still doing my undergrad courses but I would like to learn

 

[Mubeen A]

i'm sTudying physics in college.i'm interested in wave motion, electronics and special theory of relativity and nuclear physics

 

[studious]

I think we might be ready to choose a pilot subject. Which of the following previously suggested (or suggest more) do all of you prefer?

1. Classical mechanics
2. Electrodynamics
3. Quantum mechanics
4. Math topics?
...


I will be sure to soon get in contact with all those who expressed interest. We might choose a mode of communication also.

 

[Jacobpm64]

Classical Mechanics (just because I'm taking this next semester) or any math topic (because I'm going to grad school in math) is my vote.

Uhmm.. maybe what you should do is start a poll or a vote or something, that would probably be the easiest way for us to do this.

 

[Geekchick]

Classical mechanics.

 

[Troponin]

Classical mechanics.

I'm taking it next semester as well so I'm game for a little prep work before hand!

 

[Troponin]

I think we might be ready to choose a pilot subject. Which of the following previously suggested (or suggest more) do all of you prefer?

1. Classical mechanics
2. Electrodynamics
3. Quantum mechanics
4. Math topics?
...


I will be sure to soon get in contact with all those who expressed interest. We might choose a mode of communication also.

I'd like to see some modern algebra and (probably intro) analysis as math subjects.
I'd agree on all 3 physics subjects.


I'd have to think that for the study group to "last," the subjects would either have to be minimal (and somewhat broad) so that there isn't a greater number of classes than students...lol
Either that or some kind of mixture of the subjects, touching on the important (or interesting) parts of each subject.

 

[americanforest]

Definitely interested in this.

 

[Jacobpm64]

definitely some intro analysis/topology for my math area.

classical mechanics for physics.

 

[studious]

All right, it seems there is a good deal of interest in "Classical Mechanics" and various maths. Very soon, we should be sure to expand into other mentioned topics as well.

I'd have to think that for the study group to "last," the subjects would either have to be minimal (and somewhat broad) so that there isn't a greater number of classes than students...lol
Either that or some kind of mixture of the subjects, touching on the important (or interesting) parts of each subject.

I am not exactly sure of what you mean, but I too hope that the study group lasts (and more so out of our common interest in the topics than superficial commitment). We can all help fine-tune our syllabuses so that the subjects'/topics' matters are proportional to each of our interest levels.

But first, perhaps we should choose a way to communicate. Do you think PF will suffice (if so, how, without annoying post bumping schemes)? Or do we want a separate mailing list, forum (can be done), etc. especially for us?

 

[Troponin]

All right, it seems there is a good deal of interest in "Classical Mechanics" and various maths. Very soon, we should be sure to expand into other mentioned topics as well.



I am not exactly sure of what you mean, but I too hope that the study group lasts (and more so out of our common interest in the topics than superficial commitment). We can all help fine-tune our syllabuses so that the subjects'/topics' matters are proportional to each of our interest levels.

But first, perhaps we should choose a way to communicate. Do you think PF will suffice (if so, how, without annoying post bumping schemes)? Or do we want a separate mailing list, forum (can be done), etc. especially for us?

I was just concerned that if we end up with a dozen different "courses," there will only be a few people that "attend" each course. In anything set up in an informal manner, people are likely to drop out.
I figured that with fewer classes, with higher interest...and/or classes that cover a broad range with some superficiality, we'd have a higher retention rate.

Just want to make sure this doesn't fade away once it gets going.

 

[Jacobpm64]

as far as correspondence goes.. I think it'd be best to have some sort of instant way to talk to each other every now and then.. maybe an IRC channel or something.

and yeah something isolated is my vote.. a mailing list or alternate forum sounds great.

I agree with Troponin about limiting the areas studied to no more than a couple. That way everyone can contribute and help each other instead of spreading ourselves too thin.

 

[windsupernova]

I would love electrodynamics, but it looks like everybody wants Mechanics, its fine by me anyways. As long as we see some math

 

[roeb]

I think an actual website would be better than a forum. It's too difficult to sift through pages and pages of posts.

 

[Latecomer]

I'm a beginner and would, therefore, be of little help, but I'm eager to learn. I'd definitely be interested in following along.