Applying Bernoulli's equation to problems involving a perfect gas

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Discussion Overview

The discussion revolves around the application of Bernoulli's equation to problems involving perfect gases, particularly in contexts such as estimating pressure changes in a leaky space station and the effects of a train passing through a tunnel. Participants also explore the relationship between the viscosity of a perfect gas and temperature.

Discussion Character

  • Exploratory
  • Technical explanation
  • Debate/contested

Main Points Raised

  • Some participants question whether it is permissible to apply Bernoulli's equation to perfect gases for reasonable estimates, citing specific examples like a leaky space station and a train in a tunnel.
  • There is mention of an article discussing the viscosity of a perfect gas and its dependence on the square root of temperature, with requests for further information on this topic.
  • One participant suggests that Bernoulli's equation may be applicable for low-speed gas flows (Mach 0.3 or lower) under steady conditions, while noting that high-speed or unsteady flows may require adjustments.
  • References to "Transport Phenomena" by Bird, Stewart, and Lightfoot are made, indicating that it contains relevant information about the viscosity of gases in the ideal gas limit and a section on Bernoulli's equation for ideal gases.
  • Another participant suggests searching for "Sutherland's law" as a method for finding the viscosity of gases like air.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants express differing views on the applicability of Bernoulli's equation to perfect gases, with no consensus reached on the conditions under which it may be valid. The discussion regarding the viscosity of perfect gases also remains unresolved, with multiple inquiries for clarification.

Contextual Notes

Participants reference specific conditions (e.g., low-speed flows) under which Bernoulli's equation may be applicable, but these conditions are not universally accepted. The discussion includes unresolved questions about the viscosity of perfect gases and its derivation.

Hak
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I would like to know the opinions of experienced forum users regarding an issue that seems to happen often in problems: namely, applying Bernoulli's equation to perfect gas. Is it permissible to do so, even if only to find reasonable estimates? Two examples I found out might be:

- The problem of finding the internal pressure trend in a leaky space station.

-Estimating the pressure change due to a train passing through a tunnel.
(I just don't see how this can be done without Bernoulli!).

Then I also read in an old article (which I can't find now) that it is possible to prove that the viscosity of a perfect gas is well defined and depends on the root of the temperature, but I haven't found much on the web. Does anyone have any idea how to do this? Could you give me some help in this regard?
 
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Hak said:
Then I also read in an old article (which I can't find now) that it is possible to prove that the viscosity of a perfect gas is well defined and depends on the root of the temperature, but I haven't found much on the web. Does anyone have any idea how to do this? Could you give me some help in this regard?
”ideal gas” is used more commonly than “perfect gas” in English. I found several links searching on this.
 
See Chapter 1 of Transport Phenomena by Bird, Stewart, and Lightfoot for answer to your question about viscosity of a gas in the ideal gas limit. This same book also has a section on Bernoulli equation customized to ideal gases.
 
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Chestermiller said:
See Chapter 1 of Transport Phenomena by Bird, Stewart, and Lightfoot for answer to your question about viscosity of a gas in the ideal gas limit. This same book also has a section on Bernoulli equation customized to ideal gases.
Thanks.
 
Hak said:
I would like to know the opinions of experienced forum users regarding an issue that seems to happen often in problems: namely, applying Bernoulli's equation to perfect gas. Is it permissible to do so, even if only to find reasonable estimates? Two examples I found out might be:

- The problem of finding the internal pressure trend in a leaky space station.

-Estimating the pressure change due to a train passing through a tunnel.
(I just don't see how this can be done without Bernoulli!).

Then I also read in an old article (which I can't find now) that it is possible to prove that the viscosity of a perfect gas is well defined and depends on the root of the temperature, but I haven't found much on the web. Does anyone have any idea how to do this? Could you give me some help in this regard?
I believe Bernoulli's is ok for low speed gas flows (Mach 0.3 or lower), so long as the flow is steady. High speed flows, unsteady flows, and or both high speed/unsteady would need adjustment.
 
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erobz said:
I believe Bernoulli's is ok for low speed gas flows (Mach 0.3 or lower), so long as the flow is steady. High speed flows, unsteady flows, and or both high speed/unsteady would need adjustment.
Thank you.
 
Chestermiller said:
This same book also has a section on Bernoulli equation customized to ideal gases.
Is this section on Chapter 3?
 
Hak said:
Is this section on Chapter 3?
Yes, Eqn. 3.5-12
 
You might also search for "Sutherland's law" for finding the viscosity of gases like air.
 

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