# Best methods of seaching the web

Gold Member
Dearly Missed
I wanted to search for a song but all i had was the words, stay with me, i had hundreds of hits,but as yet not found what i wanted.

Destiny153

or try this site. www.findmeatune.com[/URL]

does it Work????????

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Try googling Shakespeares Sister.

Edgardo
Gold Member
Dearly Missed

Try googling Shakespeares Sister.

found it, thanks Dad face, this is one of my favorite songs.

Mentor

Google works better for something like this if you take a line from the song and put it in quotes when entering it in the search box. This tells Google to keep the words together in that sequence, instead of looking for pages that contain those words in any order, scattered anywhere on the page.

llynne
search engines are only as good as the net they are searching. most of the stuff I am looking for is not yet digitised or is pay to view. Finding a song is one thing but a search for facts ......

Mentor
search engines are only as good as the net they are searching. most of the stuff I am looking for is not yet digitised or is pay to view. Finding a song is one thing but a search for facts ......
What kind of information are you looking for?

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Gold Member
I wanted to search for a song but all i had was the words, stay with me, i had hundreds of hits,but as yet not found what i wanted.

I like to print out a hardcopy of the internet and really do some browsing.

nismaratwork
Patience helps too... and requests. It took me 6 years to get Sahra by Cheb Khaled transliterated from Arabic to English-Phonetics, but it was worth it!

Flex: Spiders... fun!... but naughty!

@llynne: "Pay to view" facts... you mean studies, background checks, LexisNexis... that kind of thing? The former is a matter of patience, the middle is skill, and the latter you pay for or doom befalls you.

Loren Booda
What was the name of the song, Wolram? I believe "Stay with Me" was by the band Free in the '70's.

Google just bought http://vark.com/ [Broken] It's kinda interesting.

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nismaratwork
Google just bought http://vark.com/ [Broken] It's kinda interesting.

Wow... and Yahoo Answers becomes defunct like that *snaps fingers*. You have to admire Google for their ability to find unique IPs that work.

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Proton Soup
vark sounds like chacha.

i think the best way to search is to already kinda know what it is you're looking for. i find that in some ways, google acts like an extension of my brain. it helps shake loose that tidbit on the tip of my tongue. that thing i think i read about in an article 6 years ago ... it's out there somewhere.

also, various filters and keywords. switching to image instead of text results can be insanely useful.

Gold Member
What kind of information are you looking for?

Sounds like he's talking about Journals that still charge $40 per article. Even with all my university's subscriptions, I still run into articles that I can't get/find free on any of our data-bases or public sites. Lots of Journals are resistant to the open access movement because they stand to lose money (APA is particularly notorious for this). nismaratwork Sounds like he's talking about Journals that still charge$40 per article. Even with all my university's subscriptions, I still run into articles that I can't get/find free on any of our data-bases or public sites.

Lots of Journals are resistant to the open access movement because they stand to lose money (APA is particularly notorious for this).

Yeah... the spirit of science and free exchange of information, right? :grumpy: The irony of course, is that those most effected are... STUDENTS! If I want that info, I can get it by paying for it, and if a kid wants it they can download it via illegal means. If you're a student on a budget... well... strap in.

See, I can understand a fee for LexisNexis, but why should anyone pay for common work-product?! My personal favorite, and this should be closer to me than most here, is the Rorschach Inkblots; THEY MUST BE SECRET... really?

When used properly to diagnose a serious thought disturbance, or psychotic/perceptual disorders... it's great, and I'm yet to even HEAR of someone who shouldn't getting hold of them. What I do hear, and have seen is this test being used as some general personality test, which is NOT the point in this day and age, and people wanting to know what the hell it's all about. On every level, I oppose that mindset of greed and insularity.

Mentor
Sounds like he's talking about Journals that still charge $40 per article. Even with all my university's subscriptions, I still run into articles that I can't get/find free on any of our data-bases or public sites. Lots of Journals are resistant to the open access movement because they stand to lose money (APA is particularly notorious for this). They exist because they make money. Take away the money and they won't exist. Cough up the money if you REALLY want it. nismaratwork They exist because they make money. Take away the money and they won't exist. Cough up the money if you REALLY want it. True, that is the status quo, but if they didn't exist, what would replace them? Mentor True, that is the status quo, but if they didn't exist, what would replace them? It's doubtful they will go away. nismaratwork It's doubtful they will go away. Hmmm... I'm sure that the RIAA thought the same for a very long time... maybe they still do. Eventually if they don't reform, there will be a black market for them, and it won't be a friendly exchange on a private network. I find the entire practice unfortunate, but I can't really argue that they'll go away, they may however find that entities such as Google actively seek their obsolescence. The APA is powerful, but nothing compared to some of the entities out there which are seeking to cenralize ifnormation. Mentor Hmmm... I'm sure that the RIAA thought the same for a very long time... maybe they still do. Eventually if they don't reform, there will be a black market for them, and it won't be a friendly exchange on a private network. I find the entire practice unfortunate, but I can't really argue that they'll go away, they may however find that entities such as Google actively seek their obsolescence. The APA is powerful, but nothing compared to some of the entities out there which are seeking to cenralize ifnormation. We're not talking about music. We're talking about science, we're talking about peer review, although that is merely cronyism in too many cases as has sadly been revealed in some horrendous abuses lately. (MMR vaccine scare fraud is one horrific case) I doubt that there is a huge number of bored teenagers wanting to set up sites for illegal downloads of scientific papers. And let's be very clear, posting copyrighted material without authorization is ILLEGAL and this forum will not in any way, shape, or form allow discussion of or condone illegal behavior. nismaratwork We're not talking about music. We're talking about science, we're talking about peer review, although that is merely croynism in too many cases as has sadly been revealed in some horrendous abuses lately. (MMR vaccine scare fraud is one horrific case) I doubt that there is a huge number of bored teenagers wanting to set up sites for illegal downloads of scientific papers. And let's be very clear, posting copyrighted material without authorization is ILLEGAL and this forum will not in any way, shape, or form allow discussion of or condone illegal behavior. I don't condone the posting, or acquisition of material that an individual or entity doesn't have the legal rights to use. My concern is that such a black market could evolve in response to the ease of Peer to Peer sharing, file-swarming, and low-level encryption being easier to implement. True, it's not likely that a gang of precocious teens will loot the APA database, but it just takes one person to do it, and not even from this country! Remember Dalnet on Irc? Good or bad, they were destroyed by a (probably Turkish) botnet using illegal means. On the other hand you have iTunes, Amazon, and a billion (ok... half a billion) others who are happy to make a buck by reading the writing on the wall. It's hard to believe that this is truly a great bastion beyond reach. Besides, the most concerning pirates for industries are academic and corporate. Not because they steal outright, but there's the "dubbing" effect; one copy is purchased, yet somehow everyone has it. Curious teens aren't spending on APA material anyway, but they do odd things in the name of "taking down the man". By the time they realize what the full impact of their actions are, the damage can be done. For instance, Sony's PS3 had it's master encryption key broken and published, and forevermore is a system that is literally dominated by bad actors. Sony has been at the forefront of DRM, and the person who cracked this had nothing to do with piracy. The result however, is the same: Sony panics and loses money, publishers worry about the fate of their titles, and end-users become anxious about the security of the product and their online experience. So... Sony will doubtless be very careful in the future, under the continuing assumption that what they make won't break. It's a vicious cycle that is obviously replete with fuel in that arena, but given time... I can see that spreading. I don't' think the result would be good for ANYONE involved. Well I had a friend once tell me my searching method is horrible and I should use quotes and type keywords that i'm searching for ect... but I have found it to be most effective. What I do is basically just type the question I am thinking of. So like you came here and posted what is the lyrics to this song it has xyz in it. <-- So that is exactly what I would type into the search and a lot of the times I will get the answer or at least a clue to it. I think with the addition of stuff like yahoo answers on the net this method works amazingly well. As the chances that one of the billions of questions asked on that site are exactly the same as what you asked the search are oddly high. It'll work for most anything and the more popular the thing your searching is the better it'll work. Staff Emeritus Science Advisor Gold Member Well I had a friend once tell me my searching method is horrible and I should use quotes and type keywords that i'm searching for ect... but I have found it to be most effective. What I do is basically just type the question I am thinking of. So like you came here and posted what is the lyrics to this song it has xyz in it. <-- So that is exactly what I would type into the search and a lot of the times I will get the answer or at least a clue to it. I think with the addition of stuff like yahoo answers on the net this method works amazingly well. As the chances that one of the billions of questions asked on that site are exactly the same as what you asked the search are oddly high. It'll work for most anything and the more popular the thing your searching is the better it'll work. Searching for the question can work, but since you're really looking for the answer, try searching for that instead. Here's what I mean. Suppose you search for, "Where is the oldest cedar?" you'll get some results and you can probably find the information with a bit of clicking. But if you search for "The oldest cedar tree" you'll get results straight away. rootX Searching for the question can work, but since you're really looking for the answer, try searching for that instead. Here's what I mean. Suppose you search for, "Where is the oldest cedar?" you'll get some results and you can probably find the information with a bit of clicking. But if you search for "The oldest cedar tree" you'll get results straight away. You are right http://www.google.com/search?ie=UTF...&aq=f&aqi=&aql=&oq=&pbx=1&fp=31bd50ee20ddd9f2 http://www.google.com/search?ie=UTF...&aq=f&aqi=&aql=&oq=&pbx=1&fp=31bd50ee20ddd9f2 If you put a question google will likely provide things like yahoo answers! Errr I generally don't type the question mark sorry if I made it seem like I did. At any rate I got basically the same results for where is the oldest cedar tree and oldest cedar tree. While your right it might be better to do it that way most the time I find it's faster to just type what i'm thinking in there. One thing I noticed is you used quotes on that search I have almost never found doing that to be effective. Gold Member They exist because they make money. Take away the money and they won't exist. Cough up the money if you REALLY want it. It doesn't quite work like that. Authors and libraries are really the main support of the journals (authors pay a much more significant fee than$40 to have their work published... or should I say you and I pay for it with taxes that become grants... but that's fine with me, and how it should be in my opinion).

There's a open access movement among librarians already (in fact, they're the ones that promote it to the local scientists here) who are the key customers to journals.

It's actually the authors responsibility to make sure his papers are easily available. Open access puiblishing been shown to greatly increase a factor called "Research impact" in integer-folds. So it's actually going to be a losing battle to be a stingy publishing company. Authors want research impact.

Of course, if you nearly have a monopoly on the field (APA, for example) there's little competition to motivate fairer prices for the readers so you can hold out longer (as they have).

nismaratwork
It doesn't quite work like that. Authors and libraries are really the main support of the journals (authors pay a much more significant fee than \$40 to have their work published... or should I say you and I pay for it with taxes that become grants... but that's fine with me, and how it should be in my opinion).

There's a open access movement among librarians already (in fact, they're the ones that promote it to the local scientists here) who are the key customers to journals.

It's actually the authors responsibility to make sure his papers are easily available. Open access puiblishing been shown to greatly increase a factor called "Research impact" in integer-folds. So it's actually going to be a losing battle to be a stingy publishing company. Authors want research impact.

Of course, if you nearly have a monopoly on the field (APA, for example) there's little competition to motivate fairer prices for the readers so you can hold out longer (as they have).

It's that mix of concern that this shouldn't be left to become defunct, and on the other hand a lack of market pressure that can be exerted, or WILL be exerted. To me, that has always spelled on thing when information in a digital format is on the line: A grey-> black market... for example:

http://www.pcmag.com/article2/0,2817,2376786,00.asp

I find that rather troubling, because the idea that behaviour that is survivable on a local level with effort, can be generalized to what amounts to a hemi-napster for books... ugh. That business wouldn't even EXIST if the pressure from piracy of ebooks and print books had not become so incredibly wide-spread.

Oh, and who gets hurt here?... The publishers, but they can probably manage to get hooks in at some point. The author, who won't even see increases in sales due to WEAR... is <insert your least favorite and most upsetting curse>.

llynne
What kind of information are you looking for?

Usually stuff on physics or historical articles out of old newspapers.
I was simple enough to believe that progress of knowledge would benefit from open information sharing.... sometimes I could get a google copy but often I am left with a synopsis teasing me. I plan to get familiar with a few libraries which have subscribed to relevant journals but I work across several disciplines and I usually have to read things before I can tell if they will be useful.
Old news is hard because a lot is on a list waiting to be digitised and then it is in the form of a jpeg which cannot be searched beyond the title.