News Breaking Down the 2016 POTUS Race Contenders & Issues

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Hillary Clinton and Donald Trump are currently the leading candidates for the 2016 presidential election, with their character and qualifications being significant issues among voters. The crowded field includes 36 declared Republican candidates and 19 declared Democratic candidates, with many others considering runs. Major topics of discussion include nationalism versus internationalism and the stability of the nation-state system versus global governance. Recent polls show Trump as the front-runner, although his support has decreased, while Carly Fiorina has gained traction following strong debate performances. The election cycle is characterized as unusual, with many candidates and shifting public opinions on key issues.
  • #931
jim hardy said:
Trump and Putin offer me some hope, they're two hard nosed men of action who might see eye to eye on the advantages offered by Western Civilization and bring "getting along with the other superpowres" out in the open.
And do not try to tell me that's not relevant to this campaign.
Trump now says he does not know Putin, never met him, has never even spoken to him. I can post that interview if you aren't aware of it. Apparently those in the position to judge these things think Putin thinks he can manipulate Trump.

Ex-CIA Director: 'No Doubt' Putin Views Trump as 'Unwitting Agent'

Former CIA Acting Director Michael Morell on Sunday doubled down on the connection he made between Republican nominee Donald Trump and Russian President Vladimir Putin.

Morell told ABC's "This Week" that he had "no doubt" Putin viewed Trump as an "unwitting agent" of Russia, and noted that as a trained KGB intelligence operative, Putin had manipulated people "much smarter than Donald Trump."

"He played this perfectly, right? He saw that Donald Trump wanted to be complimented. He complimented him. That led Donald Trump to then compliment Vladimir Putin and to defend Vladimir Putin's actions in a number of places around the world. And Donald Trump didn't even understand, right, that Putin was playing him," Morell said.

http://www.nbcnews.com/politics/201...ubt-putin-views-trump-unwitting-agent-n624786
 
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  • #932
Evo said:
Trump now says he does not know Putin, never met him, has never even spoken to him. I can post that interview if you aren't aware of it. Apparently those in the position to judge these things think Putin thinks he can manipulate Trump.
post gone, at this point what difference does it make
 
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  • #933
jim hardy said:
post gone, at this point what difference does it make
Someone complained about a post so I had to delete it and then the posts that were in response also had to be deleted.
 
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  • #934
Possible change in Congress a la Trump.

Down Ticket: How Trump could cost the GOP its biggest House majority since WWII
https://www.yahoo.com/news/down-ticket-1-trump-could-000000722.html

There was always a risk of Republicans losing the Senate in 2016. The entire map is tilted against them. Democrats are defending 10 seats this year; Republicans are defending 24. If as few as four of those seats flip — a likely outcome — the GOP’s majority is gone.

Democrats don’t have the same sort of structural advantage in the House, though. For one thing, House Republicans enjoy a much bigger cushion — 247 seats to the Democrats’ 186 — than their Senate counterparts. This means that Pelosi would need a net gain of at least 30 seats to recapture control — the kind of swing that gerrymandering largely rules out. In a normal election year, they wouldn’t stand a chance.
Harry Reid is retiring. His seat is contested by Catherine Cortez Masto (D) and John Heck (R). The race is a statistical tie, and more than 20% are undecided.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/United_States_Senate_election_in_Nevada,_2016

Other Senate races
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/United_States_Senate_elections,_2016
 
  • #935
Evo said:
Someone complained about a post so I had to delete it and then the posts that were in response also had to be deleted.

i can only imagine trying to ride herd on such contentious subject matter. You have my sympathy, dear Evo ...

I've had my say on the foreign affairs angle , thanks for leaving it up for a while

see you 'round !

old jim
 
  • #936
jim hardy said:
i can only imagine trying to ride herd on such contentious subject matter. You have my sympathy, dear Evo ...

I've had my say , thanks for leaving it up for a while

see you 'round !

old jim
You know I want you here, see my pitiful attempt at rickrolling you! :nb)
 
  • #937
Evo said:
You know I want you here, see my pitiful attempt at rickrolling you!

Well, you can't telegraph it so obvious like that, you need to be more clandestine like Hillary Clinton's trickery.
 
  • #938
I hope my post meets the rules , I just wanted to add a few thoughts myself,
the major talking point in this election for the Republicans is the need for a better border and on this issue I can agree with them.I really dislike the modern liberal viewpoint when it comes to borders , one good example is the EU.Eu has open or more precisely no borders inside and between the member states and that's a good thing , I've used it myself and it makes life easier and it also works or atleast worked because the people living in Europe more or less share some common beliefs and knowledge and world views so they won't use this free system to simply travel to a neighboring country to blow something up , but now in the advance of radical Islam and the many folks who agree with it this system no longer works , and also the fact that Europe's outer border is like non existing makes the matters worse.
And we have all seen the results of this.

I agree with @mheslep and others that this "no border" policy is a fatal mistake that probably arises from the modern humanist viewpoint that all people should be equal and given the same opportunity, as good as it sounds it's like Communism , ideal on the paper and non working in the real world.In a world were some people strive for the best and others for the worst there can be no common ground shared between these two so if the best ones want to survive and continue the growth and advancement of humanity they must also focus on sustaining that growth both environmentally and also purely from a human perspective as in the need to see your enemy.

That being said I think this election is really a hard one because atleast for me there is no real candidate.And I say this from a non US citizen viewpoint.So I think it simply breaks down to the lesser of two evils, from which one is rather more dumb than evil I think.
At some point I even favored Trump over Hillary but His foreign policy is as naive and stupid as it's non existent and quite frankly it's dangerous.If he would become POTUS and stop the support for NATO , NATO would start to fall apart and if Russia made any more advances in the Baltic region that could very well trigger a world war , so there a lot a stake not only for Europe but the whole world.
In the end the only difference between Hillary and Trump is their level of intelligence and willingness to listen to their advisors over their own personal ego.
Both have made some pretty significant mistakes to be questioned for their candidacy and both have had problems with greed over morale.

That being said I think the election result is already clear , like it's the easiest gamble in history if I were to put money on it.Trump simply can't and seems unable to put himself together to even pretend his different for the sake of power and money , the best example being that of the attacks on Khan family , I mean he had his campaign boosted by the DNC emails and all that and what he does is he comes out of that bonus by ranting some personal level BS about a family that said something about him on TV. A smart man would have atleast ignored that or replied in a smart rhetoric.

Hopefully Evo you won't take this down. But if so then I'm with Jim on his reply about the "thrown out of better places" :D
 
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  • #939
How bad can it be? https://www.yahoo.com/news/trump-gop-foreign-policy-letter-000000863.html

One of the 50 former Republican foreign policy officials to sign a scathing letter this week declaring Donald Trump “dangerous” says she would have trusted U.S. national security with Sarah Palin more than with the GOP nominee.

Apparently from the letter in NY Times:
“We understand that many Americans are profoundly frustrated with the federal government and its inability to solve pressing domestic and international problems,” the letter concludes. “We also know that many have doubts about Hillary Clinton, as do many of us. But Donald Trump is not the answer to America’s daunting challenges and to this crucial election. We are convinced that in the Oval Office, he would be the most reckless President in American history.”
 
  • #940
Astronuc said:
From your article cited:

The Trump campaign dismissed the letter late Monday.

“The names on this letter are the ones the American people should look to for answers on why the world is a mess,” Trump said in a statement. “And we thank them for coming forward so everyone in the country knows who deserves the blame for making the world such a dangerous place. They are nothing more than the failed Washington elite looking to hold onto their power, and it’s time they are held accountable for their actions.

He added: “These insiders – along with Hillary Clinton – are the owners of the disastrous decisions to invade Iraq, allow Americans to die in Benghazi, and they are the ones who allowed the rise of ISIS.”
 
  • #941
Of all the problems Trump has and his shortcomings in knowledge he does know how to brag about a few issues that concern many folks and to grab their attention in that way and also this attention grabbing works for some as it turns away their otherwise more critical evaluation from his shortcomings.
Like for example when someone asks him or others for that matter a question that shows them in bad light he simply answers like he would answer to a different question , like How are your ties with Putin or what will be your foreign policy and he just answers with " Well You know , we will build a YUGE wall , destroy ISIS fast , like real fast , like never before fast, and be good friends with Russia"
Like he simply says some of the things that concern majority of Americans in a close to fairytale way, the fact that shocks me the most is that such a large portion of Americans simply buy it.That they don't understand that none of those three things mentioned and many others can be solved that easy and also no other candidate has spoken about them so simply.

Also a hint , if a public person attempting high office (anyone for that matter not just Trump) thinks that it's possible for the US to ever be "good friends" with Russia then by this alone he must have atleast a tough mind evaluation check as it clearly shows a lack of reasoning and understanding of both political history and Russia or any other major world power in general. Putin is probably laughing his *** off in the Kremlin while watching how Trump tries to befriend him and his government.
Russia is like a fire , it can be sustained and used for good but if you go too close or try to be "friends" with it you end up with your house burnt to the ground.
Take my word for it , I live in Baltic region ,I know firsthand about all of this "Russian thing" that being said their not bad people it's just that their government always needs a counterbalance in the world because in the absence of one they simply expand in "mysterious ways".
The Cold war was actually a much safer time in which it was easier to know the future than now , because back then the world was pretty much kept in check by the US and USSR rivalry ,it would only be in the best US and also Europe's interests that the US president and government keep their foreign policy in check and with strict measures , from this perspective I am genuinely worried about the prospect of Trump's presidency.
There could be many more things to be said here about the middle east and rest but I'm sure that would trigger a complain for me getting into philosophy.
One things for sure the US would have been better off if it learned from the Soviet mistake in the first Afghan war.You can't win religion nor ideas with force, the Soviet "backbone" which was an idea about communism itself came into existence and survived a revolution because of many fanatics who believed in it and were willing to sacrifice themselves and others (mostly others :D) , no idea or belief has ever been destroyed with a bullet.You only end up with an empty budget and dead soldiers.Also one more thing I would like to touch on , speaking about ideas, religions and beliefs , one of the major topics concerning this election and the world right now -terrorism.This is one of the few very strong stances that i agree with the Republicans , mostly Trump , even though he probably brags about it so much not because he genuinely has a plan for it but to get ratings.
Islam has a deep problem with violence and I hate when modern liberals whether in Europe or the US try to hide it deny it or otherwise simply to suit their agenda.That is a slow motion suicide that we are all now a part of and it needs to be stopped or atleast heavily contained.But it's impossible to do so if they keep on telling that saying your opinion about Islam is a hate speech now and that Islam is actually peaceful.
Let me give you a good argument of why Islam and probably many other religions are not at all peaceful and please don;t delete this.
In the simplest form one could simple look and say , when was the last time a Christian blew himself up or a Hindu for some purpose but obviously this is too vague or weak of an argument so let me give you one much more fundamental one.
Many of the people who follow the teachings of the Quran live in areas were there is low or no education and there is high rates of poverty and in many cases death and destruction on daily basis.Such people will always be more susceptible to radical ideas and further violence , it simple is that way because of the human psyche and it's workings.Much like kids from abusive families tend to further follow the footsteps of their parents.
Now take this very fact into account and then go and read and try to understand the Quran and what it says.It is not a hard job to do since the Quran is one of the most printed books in human history alongside the Bible.
Quran clearly speaks about the destruction of nonbelievers and their fate and it also orders the followers of Muhammad to do their job in terms of the judgment towards nonbelievers. As all religious books ofcourse this can be interpreted and bent etc but we must understand that the area in which most Islamic nations are located and their level of education and understanding will clearly lead to the most violent interpretation , and quite frankly who knows how it's meant to be , nobody has asked Muhammad himself about his teachings.The reason why the majority of Muslim don't choose violence to full fill their faith is because their logica reasoning and common sense is stronger , but still the idea they follow is a fire in itself.

Just recently a high ranking Muslim leader in my country who couldn't be called a stupid radical secretly joined ISIS and said that he regrets ever denouncing the works of ISIS simply because he now considers himself a true follower of Muhammad.This just goes to show how infectious ideas can be.

Whoever becomes POTUS should better understand this and not buy into the overly liberal wing who support reduction in background checks and overall security measures.
Europe's disastrous no outer border and immigration policy is already showing it's ugly face and trust me you won't read about it in such liberal mindwasher sites like Huffpost and maybe not even CNN.The situation is worrying and we should better think about it or it will "think" about us and then it will be too late.But we need a serious thinker on the issue not someone who plays public stupidity and fear for ratings.
 
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  • #942
Salvador said:
... Like he simply says some of the things that concern majority of Americans in a close to fairytale way, the fact that shocks me the most is that such a large portion of Americans simply buy it ...
Why is the phrase "close to" in this sentence? :smile:

Yeah, I share your concern that so many Americans buy his nonsense and I AM an American. I do understand how they can hate Hillary but to think that Trump is a viable alternative just makes no sense to me.
 
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  • #943
phinds said:
Whey is the phrase "close to" in this sentence? :smile:

Yeah, I share your concern that so many Americans buy his nonsense and I AM an American. I do understand how they can hate Hillary but to think that Trump is a viable alternative just makes no sense to me.
Let me say this simply. Most Americans don't like the way things are going. Hillary is the status quo. Trump is change. Easy choice.
 
  • #944
phinds said:
Yeah, I share your concern that so many Americans buy his nonsense and I AM an American. I do understand how they can hate Hillary but to think that Trump is a viable alternative just makes no sense to me.

I don't know think that was Salvador's message. I think he is basically warning us not to throw the baby out with the bathwater in the sense that, if you're anti-Trump, then it's your job to drop your guard and hug every Muslims in order to prove that. We don't want to be a paranoid, racist country, but we also don't want to be a stupid and naive country.
 
  • #945
To be honest @phinds this goes beyond Hillary and Trump , there is a saying that just as one can tell your character by looking at your friends , one can also tell the fate and character of a nation by looking at their leaders.maybe this doesn't work in dictatorships and monarchies but it sure holds true in old democracies like the US.

As a foreigner I can tell the US image has never been the best around the world and it has much to do with history etc , but nowdays this image is mostly formed not by history but by the actual US policies and their products respectively.
Lately it seems the US has become a nation which is divided at many points starting from some that are of historic origin like slavery and race and ending with many which are products of modern stupidity and the lack of critical thinking or sometimes any common sense for that matter.
Shows like Honey Boo Boo, Trumps Apprentice ,the middle east affairs and budget debt , fast foods that are unhealthy and now a presidential candidate who seems much like a reality show clown in a reality show which could very well be called "The Election" only on FOX , Wednesday nights. His opponent which also has some doubtful practices and has managed to slip from a court case for her wrongdoing while in high office.

To me it seems the US is loosing it's world counterbalance position and it's been a while now that we have been witnessing firsthand something that the first president Bush called as the "New world order" don't get me wrong I'm not talking about the one which keeps conspiracy nuts entertained and makes Alex Jones rich from his Youtube BS channel views , I'm talking about a real ongoing process in which some world powers shift and some loose their position it's a complex process but we must understand that it has always been this way.The water keeps on flowing no matter what you do.

@Dotini , Trump may seem like change much like Hitler may have seemed like a messiah to some , so I have to ask you and any other thinking person for that matter to whom he seems like change ? To my mind he can only look like change for someone who has no real understanding of even basic world affairs and who is also quite ignorant , please forgive me if I offend someone with this but it's simply the truth. Trump has some good points yes but as I said I doubt he speaks them from some deeper understanding of the dangers they pose and more from a ranting perspective since that is what thew public wants to hear.@DiracPool yes you got my message , I'm not 100% anti trump or pro Hillary , for me personally this changes little but Trump and Hillary are more like titles in this election , they simply are the one person projections of a much larger and normally silent majority of people who think a certain way , the ones who want a more conservative oldschool America and for the ones who think that every race and religion can really work together and be as one and that we all are just humans and freedom and liberty is the dominant force ... sounds like a liberal news add doesn't it ?
The world clearly shows it's not possible , as long as there will be atleast a few people who will disagree and maybe even willing to use force for their disagreement there can be no peace no full liberty and no equality. History has showed us that countries rise and fall , empires rise and fall , movements rise and fall but there is one thing that doesn't change and is rock solid , it's human nature. Modern liberalism is dangerous because much like Communism back in the 20th century , it turns a blind eye on human imperfections and shortcomings in order to bring forward this openness and abstract equality they are talking about.
Atleast Communism used force and strong all seeing order to keep itself together , modern liberalism uses nothing , no force no borders no nothing , you simply take millions of people with a vastly different lifestyle and history and education and religion and blend them together in a given territory , for heaven's sake isn't this the perfect formula for a weapon of mass destruction ??

Europe is the test ground for this and it seems like the experiment is going out of control , because what's the chance that these people will suddenly say, Oh , we apologize , we were wrong , let us now become Christians or Buddhists , deny Muhammad and start working with sweat instead of living off government handouts and immigration aid money.
Many choose to go to the more developed western European countries instead of the Baltic region not because we are worse but simply because they pay more and have a higher life standard. Excuse me but isn't this pure disrespect for all of humanity ? I mean cmoon you just supposedly saved yourself from a bullet in the head yet you want to make commands and choose a Chicken burger over a Cheese one.
Back in the days people fought for their countries and died along the way and we honor that and thanks to those people we now can share the values and lifestyle of western world. These days it seems like a bunch of fools just want to enjoy life with no respect and no consequences whatsoever.

P.S. I am not speaking about all people as clearly there are always people who are different and who want to work and help us as humanity evolve , sadly I'm speaking about the majority who lack all of the things needed to become part of any decent society not just our western one.

Think about it for a second , there must be a reason why the middle east has always been at or in war either with each other or with the world.It's not just pure coincidence , I think it;s the result of their understanding or lack of , and of their religious beliefs that they are were they are.
Anybody can reach some level in life and some can become great but it requires strong will , much like making a suicide attach requires strong will , so it all comes down to the ideas one agrees upon.
 
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  • #946
Dotini said:
Hillary is the status quo. Trump is change. Easy choice.

What's wrong with the status quo? You've got a laptop and can post opinionated messages to PF of your own free will and spirit. Sounds good to me. One hard lesson I've learned in life is that, no matter how bad things seem to be at the time, they can actually get far far worse. Abraham Lincoln said, "Most folks are as happy as they make their minds up to be." In my experience I've found that is true as long as you have a roof over your head and food on the plate. Today, I'm pretty much as happy as I make up my mind to be. At the end of the George W. Bush administration, my business folded due to the economic collapse. Many of my friends and vendors businesses also collapsed and went out of business so I couldn't look to them for help. I got evicted from my apartment. The house I bought my mom in 2006 halved in value. It was bad times. So is that the easy choice for change you're thinking of when you encourage us to vote for Trump? Change is a two-way street, it can change up or change down. During the Clinton and Obama presidencies I worried about what I was doing and how I could make my life and situation better. I didn't worry much about what the government was doing. During the George W. Bush administration, I was worried about they were doing; mushroom clouds, "patriot" acts intruding on my privacy, and, by the end of that term, how I was going to feed myself.
 
  • #947
Dotini said:
Let me say this simply. Most Americans don't like the way things are going. Hillary is the status quo. Trump is change. Easy choice.
That point of view totally ignores my main point, which is that he lives in a fantasy world of his own creation. As I said, I DO understand how people can dislike Hillary and yes, I think we all recognize that people are fed up with our gridlocked congress and bankers than crash the economy and walk away with bonuses instead of jail sentences, and other serious issues, but again that does not make Trump a reasonably alternative. Fact checkers have said over and over that something like 75% of everything he says is completely divorced from reality.
 
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  • #948
DiracPool said:
I don't know think that was Salvador's message. I think he is basically warning us not to throw the baby out with the bathwater in the sense that, if you're anti-Trump, then it's your job to drop your guard and hug every Muslims in order to prove that. We don't want to be a paranoid, racist country, but we also don't want to be a stupid and naive country.
I don't get the bolded part at all.
 
  • #949
I think he meant that if you are pro Trump then you definitely dislike immigrants and Muslims in general and liberalism is a curse word in your house.
But if you are anti Trump and pro Hillary or independent and most probably liberal along the way you shouldn't simply "go with the flow" and don't be concerned with the whole globalism issue and different cultures clashing problem.
P.S. When I think about it, it's impossible to be pro Trump or anti Trump , simply because Trump himself can give you 180 degrees out of phase opinions about the same question in a matter of 10 minutes all you have to do is reword the question and ask it from a slightly different perspective.
It's like he has some sort of a Trump's special relativity thing going on ,only in this case all observers agree on him no matter their point of reference.
 
  • #950
DiracPool said:
What's wrong with the status quo?

For me, the status quo is good. I'm old, rich and far past any personal worries. So usually I vote my conscience and go Libertarian. This political season we have a rare prairie fire where there is strong chance to upset the applecart, bring down an old, fossilized party or two and pit the greatest issues of the day to a national vote. I only wish I had invested in popcorn futures.
 
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  • #951
phinds said:
That point of view totally ignores my main point, which is that he lives in a fantasy world of his own creation. As I said, I DO understand how people can dislike Hillary and yes, I think we all recognize that people are fed up with our gridlocked congress and bankers than crash the economy and walk away with bonuses instead of jail sentences, and other serious issues, but again that does not make Trump a reasonably alternative. Fact checkers have said over and over that something like 75% of everything he says is completely divorced from reality.
Doesn't matter that Trump is divorced from "reality" - whatever that is. What matters is the reality voters are confronted with, and their corresponding urge to change things. This is not about Trump, an opportunist of a high order, but about the people. The reality is that they are angry.
 
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  • #952
Dotini said:
Doesn't matter that Trump is divorced from "reality" - whatever that is. What matters is the reality voters are confronted with, and their corresponding urge to change things. This is not about Trump, an opportunist of a high order, but about the people. The reality is that they are angry.
No argument there.
 
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  • #953
phinds said:
I don't get the bolded part at all.

I wasn't talking about you specifically, I just thought you interpreted his post as being pro-Trump, which I didn't read it as. As far as the bolded phrase, it's just saying that be careful of being too reactionary to your opponents policies. Trump's blanket ban on all Muslims entering the country "until we can figure out what's going on" (whatever that means) is overly vigilant, but to react to that radical policy by being "underly" vigilant is equally un-wise.

Oh, and to add, dotani's comment:

Dotini said:
Let me say this simply. Most Americans don't like the way things are going.

Let me say this simply, most Americans never like the way things are going; that's why we have elections every 4 years and why the party leadership in the country continually oscillates from republican to democrat every 8 years with few exceptions. My point is that the fact that most Americans don't like the way things are going doesn't really mean anything, at all. And I mean this sincerely. Again, as I stated above there are exceptions, as when your standing in a food line in 1931 in NYC and living in a "Hooverville." Ok, then I'll agree with you. But since then, the dissatisfaction of Americans with the status quo is not about that, it's about being the first go to hype-rhetoric that any challenger of the incumbent office uses as a springboard for their campaign. The trained eye will recognize this and not take it too seriously. The problem with Trump is that, at least from my vantage point, he is so unsophisticated at exploiting this springboard that it's almost comical. He simply calls everything a "disaster." C'mon, can't you be a little more creative here. The military is a disaster. The economy is a disaster. Obama is a disaster. I mean, really? You know what a disaster is? A disaster is a Japanese sub sinking the Indianapolis and suddenly you find yourself swimming with the sharks, That's a disaster. Not the current state of our military.

So the point I'm making is to be careful buying into clearly hyperbolic sentiments such as the disaster's Trump like to paint. These are red flags about a person's character and intentions for the future of our country (IMHO), not reasons to rally behind him (or her).
 
  • #954
DiracPool said:
I wasn't talking about you specifically, I just thought you interpreted his post as being pro-Trump, which I didn't read it as. As far as the bolded phrase, it's just saying that be careful of being too reactionary to your opponents policies. Trump's blanket ban on all Muslims entering the country "until we can figure out what's going on" (whatever that means) is overly vigilant, but to react to that radical policy by being "underly" vigilant is equally un-wise.
I completely agree.
 
  • #955
DiracPool said:
So the point I'm making is to be careful buying into clearly hyperbolic sentiments such as the disaster's Trump like to paint. These are red flags about a person's character and intentions for the future of our country (IMHO), not reasons to rally behind him (or her).
So I'm guessing that you don't buy his argument that his having worked hard and built buildings is a "sacrifice" equal to that of the Khans who lost a son who was fighting for our country. :smile:
 
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  • #956
Actually some 30% if not more of Americans really think the military is a disaster and everything that has happened is a disaster , it's not like Trump entirely makes this up.He has some backing , the fundamental reason for this is that there is this sort of "new" America and old one , the old one being those who hold classically conservative views , like Christian based society , classic capitalism , were each pays and earns his own life and death , hence all the fuss on Republicans about Obamacare or any other social welfare for the less lucky , and that the country has been a disaster lately , Trump simply amplifies and bites into this rhetoric.
Many conservatives dislike all these rather new liberal wins , like same sex marriage , etc , I think they genuinely feel the US is not what it once was and to a degree they are correct , indeed things have changed.
I find it funny that Trump lately has said in his speeches that he will defend the L G B T Q (I'm typing the way he would pronounce the word) community which comes rather funny given his earlier and the republican overall policy on the matter , I guess he too feels that he might not get enough voters behind him.

Some of you already voiced this concern here , I just want to say that a country or empire or any other man made form of government is only as strong as the people of that country.
A democracy is a fragile mechanism that requires constant looking after and care , constant vigilance on part of everyone not just the FBI.
I don't want to sound like the bell ringer for apocalypse but in human history we have seen the demise of many once great nations and civilizations and quite frankly the US has many of the signs and symptoms of a superpower going out of steam.And I'm not saying this in a Trump's "it's a disaster , oh by the way a YUGE one" point of view , I'm saying this from a rather deep and fundamental point of view , I've been watching politics and elections and tendencies of society and economy for years and many many red flags stick out.It would be too long to writethem all down here but they are there.

The very fact that people like Trump have gotten so far is one of those red flags for some deeper inner problem , I don't think he is just a voice for some otherwise happy but spoiled Americans who simply want to kick the can around a bit for their own amusement.

Some of the nominees that Trump surpassed were actually much wiser and seemed more intelligent than Trump and yet they never ever even picked up steam along the way.More about what I just said I have thought about Europe too in this light and I think that all modern and open societies experience a turning point sometime after they have advanced enough and lived long enough in a developed society.
For example after WW2 or any other time in human history in hard times or after disasters people first think about what to eat , how to work and how to do the basic stuff in life , in such conditions it is easier to solidify society and move in a certain direction , but in our modern times when in the western world most of us have what we need to survive we turn our sights to less fundamental issues like woman's rights and gay rights and immigration etc.But we have to be careful because these more advanced things can make us less unified and as we become less unified we risk making the wrong choices and as we do so we risk the very fundamental values and pillars on which the very culture and society is built.
I'm not entirely against liberalism but one has to be careful while working on a standing structures fundaments as they hold the very structure.
It's a sort of like a Trojan horse thing.Seems modern liberalism at first but can turn out a WW3 at worst.

If you think the WW3 part was too much look at history and how the previous two world wars started.
A small flame can't do much in the wrong place or in moist surface , but in the right conditions any lucky tiny spark can ignite an inferno.

P.S. Hope you understand what I meant with this.
 
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  • #957
phinds said:
So I'm guessing that you don't buy his argument that his having worked hard and built buildings is a "sacrifice" equal to that of the Khans who lost a son who was fighting for our country.

Exactly. And the purple heart thing was disgusting, in fact, a "disaster." A real disaster. You'd rather get a purple heart from someone giving it to you than by earning it? I just don't get that. I personally would not accept a purple heart from someone willing to give me one simply out of respect for the medal. I didn't earn it and I don't deserve it, period. Both of my grandfathers served in WW2. On my dad's side, my grandpa received a purple heart from having his side ripped open by the shrapnel from a grenade in the European theater (France I think). I remember as a kid seeing it on the wall in his house and asking him about it. It was a fascinating conversation piece and although neither of my grandpa's liked to talk about the war much, I remember him telling me his story behind his purple heart.

Can you imagine this Christmas when the Trump family sit's around the fireplace and Ivanka asks daddy how he received his purple heart? That's going to be a special moment :angel:
 
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  • #958
With all due respect Dirac i don't think a man giving a purple heart to someone is in itself wrong , after all he earned it and if he loves someone or respects someone so much and wants to make it a personal gift I say let it be , a gift is a gift.You don't question it.
I think it's rather Trump's character and his absurd public profile that makes us mad when he receives some honor otherwise meant for people who sacrificed themselves for a higher goal.

If someone so wanted to thank me as to give me his honors and medals I would accept them out of respect for that persons intentions , I would simply not brag about that later and keep it to myself.At some point I even think that maybe Trump is more sincere than Hillary and really wants to be a great president but I think his Ego is so large beyond any measurable reference that it simple overshadows any slightest seed of intelligent thought that he might have and it definitely makes him unable to properly respond to any accusation or even the slightest criticism.
Putin knows this so no wonder he says only good things and verbal appreciations towards Trump because he knows that due to his absurd Ego he doesn't need no money to bribe Trump , all he needs is a few good words to make the POTUS candidate his ally.
Imagine how easy is that.
The Russians spend their money carefully , they won't just pay someone whom their not sure will make the job done so i think as of now Trump has received the help in two forms , one is compliments and the other is DNC hacking with the help of the KGB (modern FSB)
But the hacking is probably done not just because to boost Trump but to destabilize the election in general , I bet the people making world affairs in Kremlin are far smarter than any of us trying to figure this out here.
So whatever they do it probably is well thought out.
On the other hand I doubt of what many democrats are implying that Trump campaign is the "Manchurian candidate" in terms of Moscow being directly involved as such direct sponsorship and intelligence backing would be far too suspicious and they would risk a high chance of blowing their cover.
Especially with a man like Trump , he would probably make a terrible agent.
Imagine someone saying to him that he is not fit for clandestine information and then he would just blow off steam by revealing that he is so clandestine and yugely secret that Russia made him their spy only to say Oops at the end of this sentence... :D
 
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  • #959
What I would have done would have been to bring that man up on the stage, thank him deeply for the honor and then pin it back on his chest, telling him he earned it and I didn't and thank him for his service and ask the audience to give him a round of applause.
 
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  • #960
You have a good sense of how to earn peoples love there phinds , maybe you should go for the 2020 election ? :D:D

I bet many such great ideas of managing your PR have been given to Trump yet he is the way he is.Surely it's much better if you understand that yourself because you have a feeling for respect and love towards those who have fought the battles of life.

Edit: Off topic and outdated material removed by moderator.
 
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