Car low average speed vs aero drag relation

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Discussion Overview

The discussion revolves around the relationship between average speed and aerodynamic drag in vehicles, particularly focusing on how average speed is calculated and perceived by drivers. Participants explore the implications of low average speeds despite driving at higher speeds on country roads, and whether this affects the necessity for good aerodynamics in cars.

Discussion Character

  • Debate/contested
  • Conceptual clarification
  • Mathematical reasoning

Main Points Raised

  • One participant expresses confusion over why their car's average speed is low (40-48 km/h) despite driving at speeds of 100-120 km/h on country roads, suggesting a disconnect between perceived and calculated average speed.
  • Another participant questions the definition of average speed, noting that it can vary based on the measurement period (e.g., trip, fuel refill, total distance since purchase) and argues that aerodynamic drag is not relevant to the calculation of average speed.
  • A participant challenges the initial claim by stating that driving at different speeds and idling affects energy consumption differently, providing a mathematical explanation that highlights the energy required at various speeds.
  • Some participants share their own average speeds, indicating that their experiences also reflect low averages due to varied driving conditions, including city driving and congestion.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants do not reach a consensus on the relationship between average speed and aerodynamic drag. There are competing views on how average speed is calculated and its implications for vehicle aerodynamics, with some participants agreeing on the complexity of the issue while others maintain differing perspectives.

Contextual Notes

Participants highlight the importance of context in measuring average speed, noting that factors such as idling, driving conditions, and the specific time frame for measurement can significantly influence the average speed reported by vehicles.

Jurgen M
I drive car only at country roads allways at speeds 100-120km/h, no city and no idle time-heating engine etc.

Why computer allways show very low average speed , 40-48km/h?I allways have feeling that this speed is too low because I allways drive way faster then this. Indeed all my friends have low average speed, max 55km/h.

Math says this is same that you drive car at 40km/h all the time,so average speed implies that aero drag is not importnat, because drag is irrelevant at 40km/h speeds.

So how can we describe average speed/aero drag relation, can we conclude that car with low average speed don't need good aerodynamics?
Math says yes, but my logic say no, because I drive car mostly from 100-120km/h..

Is anyone here with average speed 100km/h or more?
 
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First of all what average speed? Of a trip? Since your last fuel refill? Since the first time driven (when the car was bought)?
My car measures average speed for a trip which is usually 900km, this roughly translates to 14 days (I reset trip when I refuel). Of course I cannot drive 900km for 14 days at 100km/h, so it's logical that the average speed will be way lower than that.
Average speed is usually computed with distance over time, I don't see what aero drag have to do with this simple calculation.
Have you tried reseting the average speed counter when you start doing 100km/h and read the average speed before you fall under 100km/h?
 
Jurgen M said:
Math says this is same that you drive car at 40km/h all the time,so average speed implies that aero drag is not importnat, because drag is irrelevant at 40km/h speeds.

So how can we describe average speed/aero drag relation, can we conclude that car with low average speed don't need good aerodynamics?
Math says yes, but my logic say no, because I drive car mostly from 100-120km/h..
No, it's not the same. If you drive 80 km/h for half an hour and wait at a red light for half an hour, you will not get the same energy spent as if you would have driven 40 km/h for an hour. It requires 4 times the amount of energy:
$$\frac{E_{80}}{E_{40}} = \frac{F_{80}d}{F_{40}d} = \frac{F_{80}}{F_{40}} = \frac{80^2}{40^2} = 4$$
And that is assuming the car is not idling and consuming fuel when at rest.
 
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Motore said:
First of all what average speed? Of a trip? Since your last fuel refill? Since the first time driven (when the car was bought)?
My car measures average speed for a trip which is usually 900km, this roughly translates to 14 days (I reset trip when I refuel). Of course I cannot drive 900km for 14 days at 100km/h, so it's logical that the average speed will be way lower than that.
Average speed is usually computed with distance over time, I don't see what aero drag have to do with this simple calculation.
Have you tried reseting the average speed counter when you start doing 100km/h and read the average speed before you fall under 100km/h?
My average speed is allways about 40,50km/h, last 800km,last 5000km or last 10 000km..
I didnt try that,but speed must then be above 100km/h..

jack action said:
No, it's not the same. If you drive 80 km/h for half an hour and wait at a red light for half an hour, you will not get the same energy spent as if you would have driven 40 km/h for an hour. It requires 4 times the amount of energy:
$$\frac{E_{80}}{E_{40}} = \frac{F_{80}d}{F_{40}d} = \frac{F_{80}}{F_{40}} = \frac{80^2}{40^2} = 4$$
And that is assuming the car is not idling and consuming fuel when at rest.
Yes that make sense.
 
Jurgen M said:
My average speed is allways about 40,50km/h, last 800km,last 5000km or last 10 000km..
My car has also the average speed from when it was bought till now, which is about 53km/h for 170000km. And it won't change much, because I use my car for driving in cities, conutrysides, when there is congestion, road works, highways, ...
To me it seems logical that it will settle around a particular average speed.
 

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