Finding the magnitude of the force

Click For Summary

Homework Help Overview

The problem involves analyzing a system of masses connected by a pulley, where a force is applied to a larger mass to prevent smaller masses from moving relative to it. The setup includes considerations of forces acting on the masses and the pulley, with an emphasis on finding the magnitude of the applied force.

Discussion Character

  • Exploratory, Assumption checking, Problem interpretation

Approaches and Questions Raised

  • The original poster attempts to derive the force using equations related to the forces acting on the masses and the pulley. Some participants question the validity of the equations used, particularly the derivation of the normal force and the assumptions about the angles involved. There is a suggestion to utilize free body diagrams (FBDs) to clarify the forces acting on each mass and to determine their common acceleration.

Discussion Status

The discussion is ongoing, with participants raising questions about the assumptions made in the original post and suggesting a more systematic approach through free body diagrams. There is no explicit consensus on the correctness of the original poster's solution, and multiple interpretations of the problem setup are being explored.

Contextual Notes

Participants note the lack of clarity regarding the angle used in the calculations and the need for a more detailed analysis of the forces acting on the masses. The original poster expresses uncertainty about the correctness of their solution and seeks hints rather than complete answers.

Muthumanimaran
Messages
79
Reaction score
2

Homework Statement


A force F is applied on the bigger mass 'M', which results in the prevention of smaller masses M1 and M2 moving with respect to larger mass M. The mass 'M' slides smoothly on the frictionless surface. Find the magnitude of the force. The pulley is ideal also consider the reaction force of pulley onto mass 'M'.

Homework Equations

The Attempt at a Solution


The normal force on the pulley is
$$R=2T \sin(\frac{\pi}{4})$$
The force on the system is
$$F=F_{1}+F_{2}+F_{3}$$
F1, F2, F3 are the forces on the masses M, M1 and M2 respectively.

The force F1
$$F_{1}=Ma-R\cos(\frac{\pi}{4})$$
$$F_{2}=M_{1}a$$
$$F_{3}=M_{2}a$$

If the masses M1 and M2 are at rest
$$T=M_{1}g$$
$$M_{2}a=M_{1}g$$

The force on the system is

$$F=(M+M_{1}+M_{2})\frac{M_{1}}{M_{2}}g-2M_{1}g\sin(\frac{\pi}{4})\cos(\frac{\pi}{4})$$
or
$$F=(M+M_{1})\frac{M_{1}}{M_{2}}g$$

I don't know whether my solution is correct. If I made an error, please give me a hint.
 

Attachments

  • problem.png
    problem.png
    837 bytes · Views: 514
Physics news on Phys.org
It looks like you are guessing the magnitudes of forces instead of drawing free body diagrams for each mass. For example, why is this ##R=2T \sin(\frac{\pi}{4})## true?
If the three masses move together as one, then you should start by finding their common acceleration. Then draw FBDs for the masses. Also, do you think that mass M1 is hanging vertically down as it accelerates to the right? What force (or component thereof) would provide the horizontal acceleration?
 
kuruman said:
It looks like you are guessing the magnitudes of forces instead of drawing free body diagrams for each mass. For example, why is this ##R=2T \sin(\frac{\pi}{4})## true?
If the three masses move together as one, then you should start by finding their common acceleration. Then draw FBDs for the masses. Also, do you think that mass M1 is hanging vertically down as it accelerates to the right? What force (or component thereof) would provide the horizontal acceleration?
 

Attachments

  • WhatsApp Image 2017-10-04 at 17.04.48.jpeg
    WhatsApp Image 2017-10-04 at 17.04.48.jpeg
    26.3 KB · Views: 584
There is nothing in the original drawing that says the angle is π/4, but OK we will set that aside. What about the other issues I raised in my previous post? Did you draw the FBDs?
 

Similar threads

  • · Replies 11 ·
Replies
11
Views
2K
  • · Replies 8 ·
Replies
8
Views
2K
  • · Replies 15 ·
Replies
15
Views
7K
  • · Replies 12 ·
Replies
12
Views
2K
Replies
13
Views
2K
Replies
5
Views
1K
  • · Replies 97 ·
4
Replies
97
Views
15K
  • · Replies 27 ·
Replies
27
Views
2K
  • · Replies 2 ·
Replies
2
Views
1K
  • · Replies 3 ·
Replies
3
Views
3K