Flux in a Uniform Magnetic Field

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Discussion Overview

The discussion revolves around the concepts of induced electromotive force (emf) and magnetic flux in the context of a wire moving through a uniform magnetic field. Participants explore the relationships between these concepts, particularly focusing on the conditions under which emf is induced and the implications of Faraday's law.

Discussion Character

  • Exploratory
  • Technical explanation
  • Conceptual clarification
  • Debate/contested

Main Points Raised

  • Post 1 presents four statements regarding induced emf and magnetic flux, highlighting a perceived contradiction between points 3 and 4.
  • Some participants assert that statement 3 is incorrect, arguing that the wire's movement through the magnetic field changes the effective area and thus induces an emf.
  • One participant explains that the wire can be viewed as part of a surface whose area changes as it moves, leading to the conclusion that an emf is generated.
  • Another participant discusses the electromagnetic interactions at play, describing how moving electrons in the wire experience forces that lead to an induced electric field.
  • Post 5 indicates that the original poster has resolved their misunderstanding regarding the relationship between the surface area of the conductor and magnetic flux, recognizing that the area changes as the wire moves into the magnetic field.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants generally agree that statement 3 is incorrect, but there are differing explanations regarding why this is the case. The discussion remains somewhat unresolved as participants offer various perspectives on the underlying principles.

Contextual Notes

There are limitations in the understanding of how the area and magnetic flux interact during the motion of the wire, as well as the specific conditions under which the induced emf is calculated. The discussion does not fully resolve these complexities.

Cardinalmont
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Thank you for reading my post. I was thinking about induced emf and magnetic flux and I realized I have a huge misunderstanding, but I don't know exactly what it is. Below I will list 4 statements which I logically know cannot all be simultaneously true. Can you please tell me which one(s) are incorrect in order to aid my understanding?

1. In order to create an emf in a conductor there must be a change in magnetic flux.
This can be seen by ε=NΔΦ/Δt, If ΔΦ=0 then so will ε

2. Magnetic flux is equal to the product of a conductor's surface area, magnetic field passing through that surface area, and the angle between the two. This is given by Φ=B⋅A

3 When a wire moves through a uniform magnetic field, neither its surface area, nor the strength of the magnetic field, nor the angle between the two are changing ∴ change in magnetic flux = 0 ∴ There is no induced emf.

4 When a wire moves through a uniform magnetic field, an electromagnetic force will force electrons in the wire to one side inducing an emf.

It is clear to see that points 3 and 4 are in direct contradiction of each other. I believe 3 is false, but I can't see the logical flaw! Please help me!

Thank you.
 

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Number 3 is incorrect because the wire can be considered to be part of the boundary of a surface in the rest frame of the magnetic field, and the area of that surface is changing. The EMF turns out to be ## \mathcal{E}=vBL ##. This topic was addressed in great detail in a recent Insights article by @vanhees71 , https://www.physicsforums.com/insights/homopolar-generator-analytical-example/ , but if you are a first or second year physics student, you probably don't need to understand the full detail.
 
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Number 3 is incorrect.It is a type of motional emf
 
It's also good to think about such problems not only in terms of Faraday's law but also in terms of electromagnetic interactions. In case 3 you have a wire, which you can see as a container of the gas of conduction electrons. Now moving through the magnetc field ##\vec{B}## leads to the force ##\vec{F}_1=q \vec{v} \times \vec{B}/c## an each electron with charge ##q(=-e)##. That implies that the electrons move towards one end of the wire (and are lacking at the other end). Thus an electric field is built up, leading to a force ##\vec{F}_2=q \vec{E}##. The stationary state is reached, as soon as the total force on the electrons is 0. Putting the two expressions for the forces together leads to the result given in #2.
 
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Thank you everyone! I figured out where my misunderstanding was sprouting from.
As I stated before, in the equation Φ=B⋅A, A is the surface area of the conductor.
My misunderstanding was of the bounds of each term in Φ=B⋅A

When looking at a specific area in the magnetic field, before the wire has moved into that area the value a A for that specific space is 0 because there is no conductor there. As the wire moves into the space then there begins to be an increasing and then decreasing value of A for that specific space thus resulting in a change in flux for that specific space, and an induced emf.
 

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