Programs Is It Bad to Earn All Degrees at the Same School?

[neurocomp2003]

Is it bad to do all 3 degrees at teh same school. I heard its frowned upon but
is it that bad?

 

[Dr Transport]

It is getting more common but not a good idea. Let me say this much, I wouldn't hire anyone who has never changed schools.

 

[JasonRox]

Why wouldn't you want to change schools?!

You get so much more networking, ideas and experience by changing schools.

 

[neurocomp2003]

I'm pretty sure you could also get networking and exchange of ideas through collaborations(which is what I will be doing),student sabbaticals and conferences/colloquia

The main reason I would prefer not changing schools is family. I'm kinda attached to my niece/nephew and would like to help them in academics.
But another reason is the ease of transfering from MSc to Phd at the school.

From Transports post, is it a common thing for people to decline employees who have taken all degrees from the same school. I guess that will be the major disadvantage.

 

[rad0786]

Question:

Let's say you are in fourth year and your are ready to apply to graduate school.

I was told that it is MUCH easier to get into the graduate school where you did you undergrauate since you should (hopefully) know most of the faculty.

It this generally true?

How is the application process to other schools?

 

[Dr Transport]

Question:

Let's say you are in fourth year and your are ready to apply to graduate school.

I was told that it is MUCH easier to get into the graduate school where you did you undergrauate since you should (hopefully) know most of the faculty.

It this generally true?

I went to two different schools, one was in the habit of accepting their own students. Other schools didn't think too highly of their graduates who earned all of their degrees there. The other (the one where I got my undergrad degree) basically told me that I could stay and get a Masters, but then I was out they were going to make it very diffcult for me to contimue. The school I got my undergraduate degree from has a fairly decent reputation all over the country and world, whereas the school I got my PhD from only had a reasonable reputation in their part of the country and was known for driving their really good faculty away (I got my degreeunder a guy who was an untenured research faculty member not associated with the physics department and one of the best optical properties of semiconductor theorists out there).

If you want to be with your family, go to a school that is not too far away...

 

[Cyrus]

It is getting more common but not a good idea. Let me say this much, I wouldn't hire anyone who has never changed schools.

Why not? So if I went to say, MIT for all three, you would not hire me? ...

text text text text

 

[NINHARDCOREFAN]

Why not? So if I went to say, MIT for all three, you would not hire me? ...

text text text text

lol I was thinking the same exact thing!

 

[JasonRox]

Why not? So if I went to say, MIT for all three, you would not hire me? ...

text text text text

No freaking way I'd hire you!

 

[Cyrus]

No freaking way I'd hire you!

I love you too Jason...

 

[kdinser]

Question:

Let's say you are in fourth year and your are ready to apply to graduate school.

I was told that it is MUCH easier to get into the graduate school where you did you undergraduate since you should (hopefully) know most of the faculty.

It this generally true?

How is the application process to other schools?

It's always easier to get recommendations and praise from someone you have already impressed in one form or another then it is to impress someone you have never met or worked with.

I've seen this myself at my job, I've had 5 different managers over the last 3 years and I've had to convince each of them of my value. Even with my coworkers vouching for me, I've had to prove myself to each one on an individual bases. But once that was done, I could have gotten away with a lot with no questions asked.

I'm sure employers know about this kind of thing and would be more inclined to hire someone who has proven themselves 2 or 3 times at different levels to different sets of people then someone who may have sneaked through by being impressive in their undergrad classes only.

Just a theory...

 

[Dr Transport]

Why not? So if I went to say, MIT for all three, you would not hire me? ...

Even Richard Feynman was kicked out of MIT for graduate school (JC Slater told him that even if he applied he wouldnot get in, it wasn't allowed).

It isn't a hard-fast rule, if you went to Cal Tech, MIT, Princeton etc... you'd get consideration, but many other schools not so much. But other than the super-geniuses, most people are going to go someplace else for different aspects of their education.

As for references for graduate school, get the best ones you can. If you get glowing reccomendations from some assisstant professor who is a no-name and a marginal reference from a big name full professor you are not going to get into any school. Admission committees at decent schools look at the person who is writing the reccomendation almost as much as what is says.

 

[Cyrus]

I have a questioon Doc, where do you work?

 

[Dr Transport]

Industry...And I am not allowed to tell who, what or where...

 

[Cyrus]

Industry...And I am not allowed to tell who, what or where...

You're not allowed to tell where you work? That's odd...

 

[Dr Transport]

That is da rules...

 

[rad0786]

Transportation lol

 

[neurocomp2003]

NASA or LLNL hehe would be my guesses.

 

[Cyrus]

You can say you work at NASA, NASA and LLNL are not Industry.

I find it to be silly that he cannot say where he works. I know people who work on black projects, and they can say where they work, just not what they work on or where. I think that's stupid policy not to say where you work. (Actually, I find it rather hard to believe)

 

[Manchot]

In his first post, Dr Transport said, "It is getting more common but not a good idea. Let me say this much, I wouldn't hire anyone who has never changed schools." If he said where he worked, his statement might be misconstrued as his company's policy.

 

[marlon]

Industry...And I am not allowed to tell who, what or where...

You are not allowed to say where you work ? Yeah right ... I think you are just overestimating the importance of your own work.

Jeezzuuuss

marlon

 

[Dr Transport]

I think you are just overestimating the importance of your own work.

Not my choice, I do as I am told.

 

[Cyrus]

Not trying to doubt you Dr, but that sounds VERY odd.

 

[buddyholly9999]

Not my choice, I do as I am told.

Should've joined the military..

 

[Astronuc]

Is it bad to do all 3 degrees at teh same school. I heard its frowned upon but is it that bad?

I've seen it done, e.g. at MIT or Caltech. Some students go from BS to PhD.

My university generally hired faculty from outside, but did also hire from those who graduated, but that was a minority.

I asked several of the faculty about getting all three degrees at the same university, and they indicated that it was generally frowned upon, but less so in modern days as in the past. Perhaps there's a pendulum effect, i.e. during some period it's no big deal, and during other periods it's frowned up.

I think it's a good idea to try different schools, but that may depend upon one's specialty and interests. Perhaps one can get a BS at one school, and MS and/or PhD at another school, or get both BS and MS at one school and go elsewhere for PhD.


Edit: With respect to Dr. Transport not be allowed to say where he works or what he does, that is typical of private industry, more so for certain types than others. Many corporations are private, and they prefer to maintain a certain level of privcay. I would ask PF members to respect the privacy of other members.

 

[Dr Transport]

Should've joined the military..

I am a vet...and retired from that occupation.

Thanks Astronuc...

 

[marlon]

I am a vet...and retired from that occupation.

Thanks Astronuc...

Just a second, i don't get that. You are a vet, so you have that degree. You switched fields so i guess you work in a company where they can benefit from your knowledge as a vet. Like some pharmaceutical company or some company that checks food processing for animals...

I understand that one is not always allowed to talk about the content of one's work (which is a measure that is not necessary since most of us are not doing any revolutionary work that requires that silence, but anyhow...) but what i don't believe is that you cannot say where you work or in what field. You don't even have to mention the name of your boss/company, but you DO can talk about the field you work in. That is why people do not believe your words here.

marlon

 

[Dr Transport]

And what have I said that not credible?

 

[Cyrus]

No no marlon, not a Veternarian, a veteran (as in former Military).

 

[Dr Transport]

No no marlon, not a Veternarian, a veteran (as in former Military).

That is correct.

 

[buddyholly9999]

Well, I would never want to hire someone who made a career of the military..being a fellow Veternarian myself, I know them types. I would, however, not discriminate against someone based on where they were educated at. As far as I and the law are concerned, that is illegal.

In fact, your probably better off keeping your job hush-hush because
if your viewpoints on hiring people, whether they attended the same school for three degrees or not, finds its way to your employers could be grounds for termination.

Oh yeah...and if you give me some BS like..."my employers feel the same way I do and in fact we practice what we preach"..well then congratulations for finding people that are as ignorant and unethical as you are.

 

[GeoMike]

Well, I would never want to hire someone who made a career of the military..being a fellow Veternarian myself, I know them types.

What exactly are "them types" and why wouldn't you hire them?
I think this is a pretty broad and unfair generalization.

-GeoMike-

 

[buddyholly9999]

join the marines and find out.

 

[marlon]

And what have I said that not credible?

Ok a veteran...

What is not credible is the "i cannot say where i work"-part. I assumed that to be quite obvious .Besides, again, you donnot have to name any actual names. Just a field, or a description of your professional activities will do. If you say you cannot say this, well, that is the "not credible" part. You can be a brain surgeon that works for a top secret firm. Yet without tellin' us the actual name of clinic or institution you work for, you can reveal the fact that you perform surgery on human brains...You see my point ?


marlon

 

[GeoMike]

join the marines and find out.

You can avoid defending your own statement if you like, but don't pretend like I "just wouldn't understand".
If you're going to throw something out there that, without clarification, speaks badly about an entire group of people who have choosen a particular course in life (and a respectable one at that) you should be willing to back it up with more than "join the marines and find out". Especially since the Marines are not representative of all the other service branches.

And for the record, my father was a marine for 22 years. I know the life. And he's still working in the civilian sector almost 20 years later. He has been nothing but an asset to all the companies he has worked for.
As for myself, I choose a different route - serving in the Air Force for 6 years before deciding career military wasn't for me.
There's a world of difference between the two branches (which is why I thing your generalization is fairly broad and unfair), but a fail to see any overarching flaw or trait that makes career military people unsuitable or undesirable for civilian sector employees.

Thank you,
-GeoMike-

 

[buddyholly9999]

Yeah...and letting some guy get away with saying that just because you go the same school for your post high school education career makes you less of a candidate for a job...

Oh the irony...

 

[Dr Transport]

Just a field, or a description of your professional activities will do. ...You see my point ?marlon

Optical measurements...how about that...

But I still do not see your point. Again, I still do not see how this is pertinent to the original question posed here about getting all of your degrees from the same institution.

Because I said that I would not divulge my employer, where or what should have been of no consequnce to this thread. If you wish to give that information, good for you, I cannot to because it is my employers policy. Now someday you will get out of school and get a job, if your employer asks you to do the same will you comply? If your position depended on it, I would suspect that you would because the almighty $$ is more important to your continued survival than your ego. In my chosen line of work your if you are asked to leave a firm or outright removed, the chances of ever working that field have dropped into the "nil" category because all of our competitors out there have very similar policies., i.e. you're going to spend a lot of time finding a job in a different field and pretty much be black listed in your former field.

 

[JasonRox]

Well, I would never want to hire someone who made a career of the military..being a fellow Veternarian myself, I know them types. I would, however, not discriminate against someone based on where they were educated at. As far as I and the law are concerned, that is illegal.

In fact, your probably better off keeping your job hush-hush because
if your viewpoints on hiring people, whether they attended the same school for three degrees or not, finds its way to your employers could be grounds for termination.

Oh yeah...and if you give me some BS like..."my employers feel the same way I do and in fact we practice what we preach"..well then congratulations for finding people that are as ignorant and unethical as you are.

You start the thread by saying you wouldn't hire someone from the military, but you end the post saying he's ignorant and unethical.

That has to be the dumbest post I've read on PF in the 2 and half years I've been here.

 

[Rach3]

I'm somewhat confused, are we talking about military veterinarians? That doesn't sound like a broad category.

 

[Cyrus]

You start the thread by saying you wouldn't hire someone from the military, but you end the post saying he's ignorant and unethical.

That has to be the dumbest post I've read on PF in the 2 and half years I've been here.

Have you read my posts?

 

[ballistikk]

I'm somewhat confused, are we talking about military veterinarians? That doesn't sound like a broad category.

No, no, no, this has nothing to do with the veterinarian occupation. Transport commented that he was a former vet, as in veteran, as in someone who's served in the armed forces. As for the previous comment about not hiring someone from the military...I'm speechless. I can tell you that some of the most intelligent people I've ever met have had military careers. The technological know-how of Air Force and Navy personnel alone surpasses what a lot of tenured professors ever dream of. I'm willing to bet you that someone with a combined physics and military background has potential employers in the private sector practically creaming their pants. The military gets the best toys and the best budget for the best research, for military personnel and civilian contractors. While I'm like most of the people here and wish for that research to be used primarily for the betterment of society instead of the immediate needs of defense, the two aren't mutually exclusive.

 

[JasonRox]

Have you read my posts?

Nah, I just skip by them.

 

[buddyholly9999]

Hey, Rox, bet I'm more of an alpha male than you are...how's that for the dumbest post you ever saw on PF? ;)

 

[shmoe]

Well, I would never want to hire someone who made a career of the military..being a fellow Veternarian myself, I know them types.

Is this a joke? Seriously, I'm having a hard time telling.

I would, however, not discriminate against someone based on where they were educated at. As far as I and the law are concerned, that is illegal.

So you think (at least partly) basing a hiring decision on where someone was educated is illegal? Where exactly is this illegal?

 

[Dr Transport]

As for the previous comment about not hiring someone from the military...

No where did I ever mention that...

Another clarification, I never said that it was corporate policy to not hire or consider hiring people who have all their degrees i.e. Bs through PhD from the same institution.

I would, however, not discriminate against someone based on where they were educated at. As far as I and the law are concerned, that is illegal.

The burden of proof is with the person who claims to have been wronged. If you happen to not get hired by a firm and you percieve that it was because of getting all of your degrees from one institution, unless you have some really good proof, your claims won't get too far.

You can whine all you want, but in the end that is all your going to be able to do, All the employer has to do is say is that you do not meet their complete qualifications or you were not a good fit for the position. Believe me, there are companies who will not hire graduates of certain schools, I have seen it and have been told it.

Lets say that you wrote a top notch dissertation in some area that a company really want to work in or is working in and just happened to be at one school for 10 years getting all your degrees, but your character is lacking, hypothetically you are a habitual drug user or have been picked up on DUI or any other type of misdemeanor, when they do a background or police check on you, you most likely will not get an offer. Most employers will not hire people with misdemenors in their past and a felony is a no no.

 

[franznietzsche]

Hey, Rox, bet I'm more of an alpha male than you are...how's that for the dumbest post you ever saw on PF? ;)

You clearly don't read much yomamma.

 

[Cyrus]

Doc, I still have not heard from you as to why you frown upon all 3 from the same institution? What is wrong with that?

 

[buddyholly9999]

United States of America..

http://www.eeoc.gov/facts/qanda.html

and for those of you to lazy...

Discriminatory practices under these [federal] laws also include:

employment decisions based on stereotypes or assumptions about the abilities, traits, or performance of individuals of a certain sex, race, age, religion, or ethnic group, or individuals with disabilities; and



All it takes is one person...

yup...shmoe..things shouldn't be so serious sometimes..

 

[Dr Transport]

Doc, I still have not heard from you as to why you frown upon all 3 from the same institution? What is wrong with that?

I have found that people who get all of their advanced education from one institution tend to have blinders on.

 

[Cyrus]

In what respect?