McCain's Plan for Presidential Debate #2 - Will He Succeed?

[Ben Niehoff]

McCain needs to stop saying "my friends". I understand what he's trying to accomplish politically, but he's totally failing. He says it with such a dead, practiced tone that in no way instills trust.

Or rather, I should say, I hope he keeps doing it. Maybe it will help keep him from being elected.

 

[LowlyPion]

It seems that the worm is predisposed to penalize negative comments about the other guy.

 

[LightbulbSun]

Obama gives a solid response on Pakistan, and now Mccain wants to school us on how to conduct military business. Pretty much he's acting like we're a third world country, that if we announce an attack then suddenly that will make us incapable of attacking. Way to go John! You tell us.

 

[lisab]

I wish I could get my hands on the raw data of that running opinion poll on CNN. It seems to me Obama is doing better - I see a lot of flat line when McCain is up. But I realize I could be biased, as I am an Obama supporter. Which is why I would like to have the raw data...

 

[Evo]

McCain is talking about his $5000 tax credit. That doesn't help the people who can least afford health care because they don't even make enough to pay taxes.

If I'm not mistaken, the $5,000 is for families, I believe it's half that for single people. My employer pays over $6,000 annually for my health insurance policy and they are a Fortune 100 company, the group rates they get are probably the lowest available.

McCain appears to be oblivious to the fact that 1) Individuals don't qualify for the lower group rates that their employers pay 2) That if you have a pre-existing condition, you may not even be able to get health insurance at any cost 3) that insurance companies can and will cancel your coverage after the first major illness or instantly raise your rates so high you cannot pay them, especialy if you are ill and can't work.

McCain is so out of touch with reality I just have to sit back and blink in disbelief.

 

[lisab]

I'm surprised the opinion tracking graph doesn't go negative when Brokaaaaarw speaks. I think they disable it.

 

[Evo]

I wish I could get my hands on the raw data of that running opinion poll on CNN. It seems to me Obama is doing better - I see a lot of flat line when McCain is up. But I realize I could be biased, as I am an Obama supporter. Which is why I would like to have the raw data...

After the debate, they will spend a couple of hours analyzing the debate and they will often refer to the worm results. I don't know if they have it available online after the debate, perhaps in replay?

The "wormers" are the same group through all of the debates, I believe. They are undecided voters in Ohio. McCain is getting much lower worm ratings than he did in the first debate, a sign of him losing in this segment?

I read the term "worm" BTW, I didn't make it up. They actually call it the worm.

 

[lisab]

It seems that the worm is predisposed to penalize negative comments about the other guy.

I think you're right about that, LP.

 

[LightbulbSun]

I wish I could get my hands on the raw data of that running opinion poll on CNN. It seems to me Obama is doing better - I see a lot of flat line when McCain is up. But I realize I could be biased, as I am an Obama supporter. Which is why I would like to have the raw data...

I have seen a flat line a few times for Mccain. What's interesting is how the men will go into the positive range a little bit, while the women line remains flat.

 

[LowlyPion]

I wish I could get my hands on the raw data of that running opinion poll on CNN. It seems to me Obama is doing better - I see a lot of flat line when McCain is up. But I realize I could be biased, as I am an Obama supporter. Which is why I would like to have the raw data...

I think if that worm is reflective of Ohio in general, that Ohio will end up Blue on November 4.

I sense a potential landslide.

 

[lisab]

I have seen a flat line a few times for Mccain. What's interesting is how the men will go into the positive range a little bit, while the women line remains flat.

And I see women being more favorable to Obama than McCain, generally.

 

[Astronuc]

If I'm not mistaken, the $5,000 is for families, I believe it's half that for single people. My employer pays over $6,000 annually for my health insurance policy and they are a Fortune 100 company, the group rates they get are probably the lowest available.

McCain appears to be oblivious to the fact that 1) Individuals don't qualify for the lower group rates that their employers pay 2) That if you have a pre-existing condition, you may not even be able to get health insurance at any cost 3) that insurance companies can and will cancel your coverage after the first major illness or instantly raise your rates so high you cannot pay them, especialy if you are ill and can't work.

McCain is so out of touch with reality I just have to sit back and blink in disbelief.

I agree. A large tax credit doesn't necessarily help since the folks still don't have much of a choice as individuals. The question then is - how do we put all those who need insurance in a pool? Do we expand Medicaid or create Medicaid II?

 

[LowlyPion]

The last two comments by each I think exemplify the choice.

McCain didn't close the deal.

Obama did.

 

[LowlyPion]

Pat Buchanan on MSNBC predictably thinks McCain won again.

Any more of these "wins" and McCain will be in the toilet and flushed.

LowlyPion's opinion is that Obama won the debate outright. And his last answer was a remarkably expressed and polished answer that sounded Presidential, while McCain's last answer was a stump speech regurgitation.

 

[Greg Bernhardt]

LowlyPion's opinion is that Obama won the debate outright. And his last answer was a remarkably expressed and polished answer that sounded Presidential, while McCain's last answer was a stump speech regurgitation.

Maybe I wasn't hearing correctly but I didn't hear Obama answer the question at all.

 

[LowlyPion]

Maybe I wasn't hearing correctly but I didn't hear Obama answer the question at all.

Probably not. It was after all as Brokaw said a bit of Zen to it. But it was a polished answer and inspirational enough that at the moment I was struck by the elegance of his construction. McCain's was a bit of a ramble down a campaign trodden bumpy road.

 

[Astronuc]

Maybe I wasn't hearing correctly but I didn't hear Obama answer the question at all.

Katty Kay, BBC News America, mentioned that most people were left wondering if either candidate answered any question satisfactorily, and that both Obama and McCain spend more time attacking the others policy or record.

Transcripts will hopefully be available tomorrow.

 

[Evo]

CNN has refused to post coverage of the post debate "spin room", got to hand it to them for avoiding it.

Very interesting post debate poll results.

The CNN post debate flash poll show 50% say Obama won, 30% say McCain won.

 

[Gokul43201]

Another CNN poll of debate viewers gives the win to Obama: 54% to 30% for McCain.

http://politicalticker.blogs.cnn.com/2008/10/07/cnn-poll-obama-won-the-night/

An MSNBC internet poll has a ridiculous 84% saying Obama won.

http://www.polls.newsvine.com/_ques...n-the-presidential-debate?votedOptionId=25790

The Fox internet poll has Obama winning with 61% of respondents.

http://elections.foxnews.com/

From a CBS poll of uncommitted voters, 40% say Obama won, and 26% say McCain did.

http://www.cbsnews.com/blogs/2008/10/07/politics/horserace/entry4508356.shtml?tag=centerColumn;centerColumnContent

 

[Evo]

Another CNN poll of debate viewers gives the win to Obama: 54% to 30%

Oops, yes 54% to 30%.

 

[Cyrus]

I love how he said something about being irresponsible and john mccain said, 'yeah I said that!' and then he said that's the same guy that said bomb iran. His face got pissed.

McCain dug himself a big hole by opening his mouth on that one trying to be funny.

He also referred to obama as 'that one' which isn't going to play out nice.

They also didnt bother to shake hands afterwards.


McCain was more well spoken, once again. But I think Obama came slightly on top this time.

His ending remarks were great. He really connected with the average citizen. McCain came off as, oh my father was in the navy as an admiral and we were all alone with our mom.

Admirals make a ton of money. I'm sure he was flying high with his mom and brothers/sisters while his father was gone.

 

[Astronuc]

I think it was more or less a tie. Obama didn't really gain ground, and McCain didn't really lose ground.

I've been watching Charlie Rose and his group of guest analysts discussing the debate. It's well worth watching. Someone commented that Obama didn't really inspire the audience, and McCain couldn't, even though he seemed to try, he's just not good at it.

Katty Kay mentioned that she was sitting in the media area and the 'din' started rising at the end of the first hour indicating people got bored. Apparently some/many in the media were hoping that McCain and Obama would be attacking each other more aggressively. Kay also made the comment that the serious debate got a bit too wonkish. I'd have to disagree with her assessment, since I didn't feel like either candidate really gave the level of detail I'd like to know.

As for the last question, neither Obama or McCain answered it satisfactorily, according to Doris Kearns Goodwin.

http://www.charlierose.com/shows/2008/10/07/1/live-coverage-of-the-second-presidential-debate (video should be available sometime the following day)

 

[Evo]

They also didnt bother to shake hands afterwards.

McCain tapped Obama on the shoulder, but when he turned, he turned into McCain's wife, so shook her hand. McCain didn't extend his hand again, so Obama turned back around. That could have looked like Obama snubbed McCain.

The two strictly Republican commentators on CNN both agreed that McCain blew the debate, he needed to be strong, and he wasn't.

Obama made a goof when he commented on computers saying that a group of military scientists developed computers due to a need to communicate, nope that was the internet. Probably most people missed that.

Of course then there is McCain saying over and over America "needs a steady hand on the tiller", well that would be Obama. We know what a hot head Mccain is.

 

[Cyrus]

I also got annoyed with McCain always calling me 'friend'.

 

[LowlyPion]

Obama made a goof when he commented on computers saying that a group of military scientists developed computers due to a need to communicate, nope that was the internet. Probably most people missed that.

I caught that. Glad he didn't connect it with the Internet though or we would start digging up the ghost of Al Gore inventing the darn thing again.

 

[Cyrus]

I caught that. Glad he didn't connect it with the Internet though or we would start digging up the ghost of Al Gore inventing the darn thing again.

He invented global warming ignoranus.

 

[WarPhalange]

Man, it seems like every time the internet is invented, I'm not around to get some of the glory for it. =/

 

[LowlyPion]

He invented global warming ignoranus.

You may have missed it, but a week or so ago McCain's economic adviser was claiming that McCain had effectively enabled the Blackberry by supporting some communication legislation.

 

[lisab]

He also referred to obama as 'that one' which isn't going to play out nice.

My jaw dropped when I heard that! What a very strange choice of words...

 

[LowlyPion]

My jaw dropped when I heard that! What a very strange choice of words...

It for sure won't play well in minority communities. But then I don't think McCain was ever going to get much of a harvest from minorities.

That's likely the kind of condescension that springs from his inner dialog with himself. It sounded to me like a slip, and I think it was a glimpse of the inner boorish brat that the RollingStone piece addressed..

 

[Cyrus]

I think you all are making too much out of it.

Anyone with half a brain should have realized 'that one over there' meant 'that democrat over there'.

 

[Ben Niehoff]

It for sure won't play well in minority communities. But then I don't think McCain was ever going to get much of a harvest from minorities.

If by "minorities" you mean "black people", yes. I thought Hispanic voters tended to vote Republican? Mostly for religious reasons. I could be wrong.

I don't think either candidate really came out on top. Neither of them answered questions to acceptable detail. Both of them pointed the finger at each other. Neither of them succeeded in connecting with ordinary Americans or inspiring anybody much.

I'm voting for Obama, but I'm kinda disappointed by his lack of excitability. It has been a flaw of three Democratic nominees in a row, now: calm, collected, intelligent, but unable to grab the audience and say, "You and me, we need to work together to make America great". McCain, of course, attempted that sort of rhetoric, but he can't pull it together either.

I think this is the real reason he chose Sarah Palin (I mean, besides the obvious reason of pandering to the [quite scary] Evangelistic Christian vote): She is an excitable character and can get people riled up, even if only with vapid, quasi-grammatical comments and outright lies.

Joe Biden gave a much stronger debate that Obama, and I'm glad he's on the ticket. I hope that the Obama campaign can maintain enough momentum to last through Nov 4, because I don't think the debates are going to propel him in any way.

 

[Ivan Seeking]

Whewwww! No big scores, but given the post-debate review and my own impressions, I tend to think that Obama will gain a point or two - esp in key swing States.

Obama looked esp good hammering McCain on his cheesy "don't announce your intentions" nonsense. And yes, McCain looked pissed!

 

[cristo]

Obama made a goof when he commented on computers saying that a group of military scientists developed computers due to a need to communicate, nope that was the internet. Probably most people missed that.

He could have been talking about Colossus, the machine at Bletchley Park designed to crack German code.

 

[Borek]

He could have been talking about Colossus, the machine at Bletchley Park designed to crack German code.

Shhh, that's in UK. And substantial part of the work was done by Polish mathematicians