Pulley system: 2 pulleys and 3 mass

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SUMMARY

The discussion focuses on a physics problem involving a pulley system with two pulleys and three masses, specifically analyzing the acceleration of mass M1. The derived formula for the acceleration of mass M1 is given by: a = \frac{3*m2*M2-m1*M1-m1*M2-m2*M1-4*m1*m2}{(m2+m1)*(M1+M2)+4*m1*m2}. Participants emphasize the importance of considering the effects of all masses, including M2, m1, and m2, on the overall acceleration. The conversation highlights the necessity of correctly accounting for tensions in both ropes to achieve the correct solution.

PREREQUISITES
  • Understanding of Newton's second law: F = ma
  • Knowledge of tension in ropes and its role in pulley systems
  • Familiarity with basic algebraic manipulation of equations
  • Concept of acceleration in relation to gravitational force
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  • Study the effects of multiple masses in pulley systems
  • Learn about tension calculations in complex pulley arrangements
  • Explore advanced dynamics involving frictionless systems
  • Investigate the role of acceleration in multi-body systems
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Students studying physics, particularly those focusing on mechanics and dynamics, as well as educators seeking to enhance their understanding of pulley systems and forces in motion.

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Homework Statement


Note: My textbook and first language is french, I am sorry if I mistranslated some terms.

A friction-less rope goes around the fix pulley A. At one side of the rope, there is a mass M1. On the other side, there is a pulley of mass M2. Another friction-less rope goes around that second pulley. Mass m1 and m2 are at the extremeties. Show that the acceleration of mass m1 is given by:

\frac{3*m2*M2-m1*M1-m1*M2-m2*M1-4*m1*m2}{(m2+m1)*(M1+M2)+4*m1*m2}


Homework Equations



\sum F = ma

The Attempt at a Solution



[URL]http://imgur.com/1OzYU[/URL]

For the first part, where we take The pulley M2 and the mass M1:
M1*a = M1*g-T where T is the tension
-(M2+m1+m2)a = (M2+m1+m2)g - T

T = M1g-M1a

a = \frac{-(M1-M2-m1-m2)}{M1+M2+m1+m2} g

Then I take the second part separately:

m2a = m2g -T2 where T2 is the tension in that second rope
-m1a = m1g - T2

T2 = m2g-m2a

a = \frac{m2-m1}{m2+m1} g


Then I add both acceleration to have the total acceleration of m1

a_{total} = (\frac{m2-m1}{m2+m1} - \frac{M1-M2-m1-m2}{M1+M2+m1+m2}) g

I tried to put both fractions on same denumerator both my answer =/= to the answer I should get...

What am I doing wrong?
 

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You start by finding the tension and acceleration for the rope on the fixed pulley, but you're only taking into account masses M1 and M2. Masses m1 and m2 will have some effect, too.

You can take their effect into account by adding 2xT2 to the force that M2 is contributing to the M1/M2 subsystem, or you can start with the M2 subsystem instead, where M2 is assumed to be accelerating with some as yet unknown acceleration a. Note that this 'a' will affect the whole m1/M2/m1 subsystem -- in effect it alters the 'g' that it is working with...
 

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