Relating derivative to original function

Click For Summary

Homework Help Overview

The problem involves a differentiable function f defined on an interval [a, b] with the condition that f(a) = 0 and a bound on the derivative in relation to the function itself. The goal is to prove that f is identically zero on the interval.

Discussion Character

  • Exploratory, Assumption checking, Problem interpretation

Approaches and Questions Raised

  • Participants discuss using contradiction as a method, with one attempting to show that if f(c) > 0 for some c in [a, b], it leads to a contradiction. Another participant explores the use of supremum values for f and its derivative, questioning how to show that M0 must be zero.

Discussion Status

The discussion is ongoing, with participants providing hints and clarifications to each other. There is an acknowledgment of the need to justify certain steps, and some participants are exploring the implications of their assumptions regarding the bounds on M and M0.

Contextual Notes

Participants are working under the constraints of the problem statement and the properties of differentiable functions, with specific attention to the implications of the given inequality involving the derivative and the function itself.

linearfish
Messages
25
Reaction score
0

Homework Statement


Let [a, b] be an interval in R, and f:[a, b] -> R be differentiable on [a, b]. Assume f(a) = 0, and that there is a number M such that
\left|f'(x)\right| \leq M \left|f(x)\right|
for all x in [a, b]. Prove that f is identically 0 on [a, b].

Homework Equations


Mean Value Theorem?


The Attempt at a Solution


I've tried this problem multiple times and I keep hitting a wall. I've tried to approach it through contradiction, letting c be some point in [a, b] such that f(c) > 0, but it always seems that we could find an M sufficiently large such that this is true.
 
Physics news on Phys.org
I found some hints in Rudin and I think I've almost got it but I can't justify one step:

Fix x0 in [a,b], let M0 = sup|f(x)| and M1 = sup|f'(x)| for a < x < x0. (Should be less than or equal to).

Then for any such x,
\left|f(x)\right| \leq M_1 (x_0 - a) \leq A (x_0 - a) M_0

The middle step I can justify with the MVT and the next one with the given relation between f and its derivative. Now how do I show that M0 must be 0. I believe it has something to do with how we choose x0 (we can choose it to be very small). Thanks.
 
linearfish said:
\left|f(x)\right| \leq M_1 (x_0 - a) \leq A (x_0 - a) M_0
Should that A be an M?

Anyway, suppose for a contradiction that M0>0. We may also assume that M>0 (why?). By definition, we have

M_0 \leq M (x_0 - a) M_0.

What does this tell us?
 
Yes, that should be an M, thank you.

I can see why M > 0. If M < 0 we would have

0 \leq \left| f&#039;(x) \right| \leq M \left| f(x) \right| \leq 0

and we are done.

Now if M0 > 0, then we must have

M (x_0 - a) \geq 1

for all x in (a, x0), but this fails if we choose x to be a + 1/(2M).

M (a + \frac{1}{2M} - a) = M(\frac{1}{2M}) = \frac{1}{2} \geq 1.

Is this the idea? Thanks for the help.
 
Yup, that's the idea. (That last \geq should really be a &lt; though!)
 
Right, I meant that as a contradiction. Thanks again for the help.
 

Similar threads

  • · Replies 6 ·
Replies
6
Views
2K
  • · Replies 5 ·
Replies
5
Views
2K
  • · Replies 20 ·
Replies
20
Views
3K
Replies
26
Views
3K
Replies
9
Views
1K
  • · Replies 11 ·
Replies
11
Views
3K
  • · Replies 8 ·
Replies
8
Views
1K
Replies
1
Views
2K
  • · Replies 2 ·
Replies
2
Views
2K
  • · Replies 4 ·
Replies
4
Views
2K