Relativistic Aberration Formula & Lorentz Transformation

Click For Summary

Discussion Overview

The discussion centers on the derivation of the relativistic aberration formula, specifically examining the relationship between light rays emitted from a moving source and their transformation between different reference frames. The conversation explores theoretical aspects of relativistic effects on light propagation and observer-dependent quantities.

Discussion Character

  • Exploratory
  • Technical explanation
  • Conceptual clarification
  • Debate/contested

Main Points Raised

  • One participant proposes using analytical geometry to derive the aberration formula instead of the typical velocity addition process, questioning whether the transformed light ray would pass through a specific point in the lab frame.
  • Another participant emphasizes that the path of a light ray is independent of the observer, suggesting that different observers use different coordinate systems to describe the same reality.
  • It is noted that the angle of the light ray is observer-dependent, which can be calculated from the set of points representing the light ray in space-time.
  • A later reply confirms understanding of the initial question and suggests that the proposed method for deriving the aberration formula should work, but emphasizes the need for actual calculations to verify this.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants express differing views on the method of deriving the relativistic aberration formula, with some supporting the analytical geometry approach while others focus on the Lorentz transformation. The discussion remains unresolved regarding the preferred method of derivation.

Contextual Notes

The discussion includes assumptions about the independence of light paths from observers and the nature of observer-dependent quantities, but these assumptions are not universally accepted among participants.

Tahmeed
Messages
81
Reaction score
4
Let's assume that a light source is moving parralel to x-axis and is in point x,y,z in lab frame. Suppose it emits a light ray. In the rest frame that coincides with the lab frame, the light source is in point x',y and z.
However, because of relativistic aberration the two light rays will make different angle with origin. Obviously, in the rest frame the light ray will create a straight line from origin to the source x',y,z that has a certain slope theta. This theta will be transformed by relativistic aberration equation. But will this transformed ray pass through point x,y,z in the lab frame? If that's the case, can't we use analytical geometry of straight lines to derive the aberration formula instead of using typical velocity addition process??
 
Physics news on Phys.org
I'm not sure I understand the question. Conceptually, if you have a single light ray, it follows a specific path through space-time which can be regarded as being independent of the observer.

One observer might use (t,x,y,z) coordinates, the other observer might use (t', x', y', z') coordinates, but they are just different descriptions (labels) by different observers of the same "reality". The last point is a bit philsophical, of course, but that's a convenient description of something that can be expressed in observer independent terms.

One can regard the light ray as consisting of a set of points (events) in space-time. One can transform the individual points (t,x,y,z) which comprise this set of points which represent the light ray from the unprimed coordinates to primed coordinates (t', x', y', z') via the Lorentz transform. So knowing the path in one coordinate system allows one to compute the path in any other coordinate system as long as the new coordinate system is adequately specified. In this example, sepcifying the relative velocity of the two coordinate systems and one shared point is sufficient to define the relationship between the primed and unprimed coordinates.

The angle is an observer-dependent quantity which then can be calculated from the set of points that make up the light ray. Contrast the observer dependence of the angle, with the non-observer dependent quantities previously discussed.
 
pervect said:
I'm not sure I understand the question. Conceptually, if you have a single light ray, it follows a specific path through space-time which can be regarded as being independent of the observer.

One observer might use (t,x,y,z) coordinates, the other observer might use (t', x', y', z') coordinates, but they are just different descriptions (labels) by different observers of the same "reality". The last point is a bit philsophical, of course, but that's a convenient description of something that can be expressed in observer independent terms.

One can regard the light ray as consisting of a set of points (events) in space-time. One can transform the individual points (t,x,y,z) which comprise this set of points which represent the light ray from the unprimed coordinates to primed coordinates (t', x', y', z') via the Lorentz transform. So knowing the path in one coordinate system allows one to compute the path in any other coordinate system as long as the new coordinate system is adequately specified. In this example, sepcifying the relative velocity of the two coordinate systems and one shared point is sufficient to define the relationship between the primed and unprimed coordinates.

The angle is an observer-dependent quantity which then can be calculated from the set of points that make up the light ray. Contrast the observer dependence of the angle, with the non-observer dependent quantities previously discussed.

Yes, you got my question right. So, the relativistic aberration formula can be derived the way I suggested then?
 
Tahmeed said:
Yes, you got my question right. So, the relativistic aberration formula can be derived the way I suggested then?

I'd say that it should work - the real proof is in actually carrying out the calculations and comparing the answers, though.
 

Similar threads

  • · Replies 101 ·
4
Replies
101
Views
7K
  • · Replies 9 ·
Replies
9
Views
2K
Replies
8
Views
1K
  • · Replies 4 ·
Replies
4
Views
2K
  • · Replies 10 ·
Replies
10
Views
1K
  • · Replies 6 ·
Replies
6
Views
2K
  • · Replies 34 ·
2
Replies
34
Views
3K
  • · Replies 7 ·
Replies
7
Views
2K
  • · Replies 32 ·
2
Replies
32
Views
4K
  • · Replies 25 ·
Replies
25
Views
2K