Tom DeLay: Indicted on conspiracy charges

[rachmaninoff]

[SOLVED] Tom DeLay: Indicted on conspiracy charges

DeLay Indicted in Texas Campaign Finance Probe
WASHINGTON (AP) -- A Texas grand jury on Wednesday charged Rep. Tom DeLay and two political associates with conspiracy in a campaign finance scheme, an indictment that could force him to step down as House majority leader.

http://www.nytimes.com/aponline/national/AP-DeLay-Investigation.html?hp&ex=1127966400&en=2cf6902ed6f45124&ei=5094&partner=homepage

Who's surprised?

 

[SOS2008]

http://www.nytimes.com/aponline/national/AP-DeLay-Investigation.html?hp&ex=1127966400&en=2cf6902ed6f45124&ei=5094&partner=homepage

Who's surprised?

I was about to post this in the Republican Lies thread. I'm not surprised he is guilty, but I am surprised he has been indicted. Perhaps there is hope...

 

[pattylou]

Woo hoo! I did a rooster crow when I saw that on Google news and my five year old was so surprised - I haven't whooped at the news ever, in her memory.

 

[arildno]

Yet another criminal Republican. I'm not surprised.

 

[faust9]

Yet another criminal Republican. I'm not surprised.

Well, he IS innocent until proven guilty.
However, I FEEL he is a dirty rotten scoundrel

 

[arildno]

Well, he IS innocent until proven guilty.

So was Nixon and a gazillion of others from that crime factory.

 

[Tarheel]

My favorite quote from Kevin Madden (Delay's Spokesman)

“They could not get Tom DeLay at the polls. They could not get Mr. DeLay on the House floor. Now they’re trying to get him into the courtroom. This is not going to detract from the Republican agenda.”

Who is "they"? Must be the Democrat and Liberal trash that plaque us all

I wish he would elaborate on this "agenda" of theirs.

 

[2CentsWorth]

Well, he IS innocent until proven guilty.
However, I FEEL he is a dirty rotten scoundrel

Right, we know he's a dirty rotten scoundrel, and it's great to see the indictment...but will there be a conviction?

 

[edward]

Delay is now qualified for the Freedom medal.

 

[arildno]

Hopefully, it will be shown that he fulfills the criteria of the three-strikes-rule..

 

[TRCSF]

Yet another criminal Republican. I'm not surprised.

"The criminal indictment of Majority Leader Tom Delay is the latest example that Republicans in Congress are plagued by a culture of corruption at the expense of the American people."

-Nancy Pelosi

 

[faust9]

What's funny is DeLay has been smacked down a couple of times for ethics violations and now suddenly it's a conspiracy against him. There are a bunch of people in Washington with the crimal "Not my fault" mentality these days.

This is funny---the truth hurts some times: http://www.mikehersh.com/Tom_DeLays_Ethics_Violations.shtml

 

[Echo 6 Sierra]

Isn't there a get out of jail free loophole for Legislators "while performing the duties of their office" or is that just a State thing?

 

[faust9]

Isn't there a get out of jail free loophole for Legislators "while performing the duties of their office" or is that just a State thing?

That has nothing to do with the current fiasco. DeLay founded nd ran a PAC which took donations from corporations in violation of Texas law. DeLay is begin charged with conspiracy in connection to trying to hide these deals from not for passing a law that resulted in a death or injury. The charges are not connected to the office, they are connected to the man.

Also, it's all the democrats fault: http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/articles/A64194-2005Apr18.html

 

[Informal Logic]

That has nothing to do with the current fiasco. DeLay founded nd ran a PAC which took donations from corporations in violation of Texas law. DeLay is begin charged with conspiracy in connection to trying to hide these deals from not for passing a law that resulted in a death or injury. The charges are not connected to the office, they are connected to the man.

Also, it's all the democrats fault: http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/articles/A64194-2005Apr18.html

According to one of the links I was reading in the thread about Republican lies, there has been an unspoken agreement between the two parties not to pursue investigations. I believe this is a result of grass root petitions, letters, etc. either by constituents and/or private organizations. When the checks and balances of the governmental system fails, it is up to the people to demand corrections, and perhaps they are.

 

[Manchot]

I love how Delay's lawyers love to put the blame on an "overzealous prosecutor," but they ignore the fact that the grand jury also decided to indict him.

If he is convicted, you know that he'll be pardoned anyway.

 

[Informal Logic]

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/9507677/

A defiant DeLay insisted he was innocent and called the prosecutor a “partisan fanatic.”

“I have done nothing wrong. ... I am innocent,”

That is so...criminal like.

 

[Ivan Seeking]

I lilke how they are accusing the DA of partisanship. In fact he has prosecuted more Democrats than Republicans; which is no small challenge in Texas.

I was sleeping and could hear the TV, and it was the first thing that I heard today. It's the first time that I've woke up smiling in a long time.

Finally, finally, finally...

 

[faust9]

I love how Delay's lawyers love to put the blame on an "overzealous prosecutor," but they ignore the fact that the grand jury also decided to indict him.

If he is convicted, you know that he'll be pardoned anyway.

Man I would love to watch him get goose-stepped all the way to the gulag; however, I too expect a Bush pardon following an unfavorable verdict.

 

[russ_watters]

Happy to see him go - he can take Frist with him.

 

[faust9]

Happy to see him go - he can take Frist with him.

Frist seems to be doing a good job of ending his political career himself. No need for the Texas exterminator to get involved in the Frist affair.

 

[Informal Logic]

Man I would love to watch him get goose-stepped all the way to the gulag; however, I too expect a Bush pardon following an unfavorable verdict.

People are tired of investigations into DeLay's activities (not to mention the repeated cost to the tax payers). If he is not convicted it will have negative repercussions for the Republican party, and they know it. It would just be another Bush bungle if he let's DeLay squirm out again.

 

[Ivan Seeking]

Did anyone notice that DeLay stuttered when he tried so say "I have violated no law". Stuttering like that is one indicator of a lie.

 

[SOS2008]

Frist seems to be doing a good job of ending his political career himself. No need for the Texas exterminator to get involved in the Frist affair.

Wait, isn't DeLay the exterminator, and Bush the terminator (as in executioner?)

 

[Manchot]

People are tired of investigations into DeLay's activities (not to mention the repeated cost to the tax payers). If he is not convicted it will have negative repercussions for the Republican party, and they know it. It would just be another Bush bungle if he let's DeLay squirm out again.

I have never understood this "cost to the taxpayers" argument. The judges, prosecutors, bailiffs, and clerks are paid regardless of whether they are prosecuting Tom DeLay or not.

On a side note, according to MSNBC, the grand jury's foreman, William Gibson, had this to say:

The grand jury’s foreman, William Gibson, told The Associated Press that Earle didn’t pressure members one way or the other. “Ronnie Earle didn’t indict him. The grand jury indicted him,” Gibson told The Associated Press in an interview at his home.

Gibson, 76, a retired sheriff’s deputy in Austin, said of DeLay: “He’s probably doing a good job. I don’t have anything against him. Just something happened.”

 

[SOS2008]

I have never understood this "cost to the taxpayers" argument. The judges, prosecutors, bailiffs, and clerks are paid regardless of whether they are prosecuting Tom DeLay or not.

On a side note, according to MSNBC, the grand jury's foreman, William Gibson, had this to say:

I think that was in reference to the cost of investigations:

Since then, 21 special investigations have been launched, with seven leading to convictions and five still active. The total cost passed $166 million through the last fiscal year.

http://www.cnn.com/ALLPOLITICS/stories/1999/06/30/ic.history/index.html

 

[rachmaninoff]

I think that was in reference to the cost of investigations:

http://www.cnn.com/ALLPOLITICS/stories/1999/06/30/ic.history/index.html

That's the total cost of the Independent Counsel Act, over the past 27 years.

 

[loseyourname]

I'm going to have to cast my bet in the hat that says nothing happens to DeLay. As rotten as he may be, he doesn't seem to be guilty of conspiracy. After watching several channels of partisan bickering, Dan Abrams finally gave a legal analysis of the indictment and called it one of the weakest he's ever seen. DeLay is almost certainly guilty of bad ethical practices, but it seems his campaign used legitimate loopholes that everybody was using and there is no evidence of his personal involvement.

I wouldn't start the cheering just yet. Earle could very well just be making a damn fool of himself. Good luck to him, though.

 

[SOS2008]

That's the total cost of the Independent Counsel Act, over the past 27 years.

And getting more and more expensive:

The Clintons' lawyer, David Kendall, called the report "the most expensive exoneration in history. Their investigation was unprecedented in its seven-year length, $70 million expense and unremitting intensity. But it ends as it began: with no evidence of any wrongdoing by the Clintons." The investigation began in 1994 and ended in 2000.

http://multimedia.cbs.com/stories/2002/03/20/politics/main504201.shtml

I suppose $70 million isn't much these days, but multiply that by what ever number of investigations may be ongoing at any given time (unfortunately often overlapping) and ask the tax payers how they feel about it.

 

[rachmaninoff]

And getting more and more expensive:

http://multimedia.cbs.com/stories/2002/03/20/politics/main504201.shtml

I suppose $70 million isn't much these days, but multiply that by what ever number of investigations may be ongoing at any given time (unfortunately often overlapping) and ask the tax payers how they feel about it.

Don't multiply it by more than two - the total 27-year cost you posted above was $166 million. Sounds reasonable to me; the GAO audits everything, of course (try googling "GAO financial audit independent counsel" to get a list of audits).

 

[rachmaninoff]

Here's a gem:

""What we do here is more important than who we are..."

-Rep. Roy Blunt (R-MO), the new House majority leader replacing DeLay, on his indictment
New York Times, 9/29

 

[SOS2008]

Don't multiply it by more than two - the total 27-year cost you posted above was $166 million. Sounds reasonable to me; the GAO audits everything, of course (try googling "GAO financial audit independent counsel" to get a list of audits).

The first post was between Watergate to Whitewater. How many investigations are there at this time? At least five, maybe ten? As stated, it's not a lot in comparison to other issues such as the cost for Iraq, but there is a cost.

 

[Astronuc]

I love how Delay's lawyers love to put the blame on an "overzealous prosecutor," but they ignore the fact that the grand jury also decided to indict him.

Ronnie Earle may be zealous - but it was a Grand Jury which indicted Delay. Obviously Earle made a reasonable case to the Jury.

http://www.co.travis.tx.us/district_attorney/default.asp

http://www.ronnieearle.com/index2.html

 

[Ivan Seeking]

Not to mention that he has prosecuted 12 democrats, and 3 republicans. The case is more easily made that he's working against the democrats.

 

[loseyourname]

When DeLay's defense attorney was on the Abrams report, he explained that he is contending Earle goes after his political enemies, not Republicans specifically.