What happens when an uncharged object is brought into an electric field?

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Homework Help Overview

The discussion revolves around the behavior of an uncharged object when it is introduced into an electric field. Participants are examining the concept of induced charge and the resulting forces acting on the object, particularly in the context of electric fields generated by charged plates or isolated charges.

Discussion Character

  • Exploratory, Conceptual clarification, Mathematical reasoning

Approaches and Questions Raised

  • Participants explore the idea that an uncharged object can experience a force due to induced charges when placed in an electric field. Questions arise about the neutrality of the object and the implications of moving it into different configurations, such as between capacitor plates.

Discussion Status

The discussion is active, with participants providing examples and questioning the assumptions about electric fields and forces. Some have suggested specific scenarios, such as the insertion of a third plate into a capacitor, to illustrate the concepts. There is ongoing exploration of the relationship between electric field strength, distance, and induced charge effects.

Contextual Notes

Participants are considering various configurations of electric fields and the effects of introducing additional materials, such as dielectric plates, into these fields. There is a focus on the implications of changing distances and the resulting electric field characteristics.

aspodkfpo
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Homework Statement
What happens when an uncharged object is brought into an electric field? Textbook states that a charge is induced within the object and so it experiences the force. Isn't the object still neutral, why would it experience a force?

*Attempt at solution box isn't working.
Relevant Equations
none
Tecd
 
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aspodkfpo said:
Homework Statement:: What happens when an uncharged object is brought into an electric field? Textbook states that a charge is induced within the object and so it experiences the force. Isn't the object still neutral, why would it experience a force?

*Attempt at solution box isn't working.
Relevant Equations:: none

Tecd
If it is a uniform field then you are right, there is no net force. But say it is from an isolated positive charge. Within the body, negative charges will move towards it and positive charges away. The negative charges are now closer to the isolated charge than the repulsed positive charges are, so experience the greater force.
 
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Another example: take a parallel plate capacitor, put Q on one plate and -Q on the other (no externally applied emf).

Slowly move a third, uncharged plate of finite thickness and area equal to the capacitor plates into the gap. There is a force acting to pull the third plate into alignment with the two capacitor plates.

You can compute quantitatively (ignoring E field fringing effects, or plate area >> plate separation) by invoking virtual work. The E field is unchanged after the third plate is inserted but the volume per unit area is reduced due to the thickness of the third plate, so total field energy after the insertion is less than total field energy before insertion.

(BTW the same thing happens when you move a dielectric into the capacitor).
 
rude man said:
Another example: take a parallel plate capacitor, put Q on one plate and -Q on the other (no externally applied emf).

Slowly move a third, uncharged plate of finite thickness and area equal to the capacitor plates into the gap. There is a force acting to pull the third plate into alignment with the two capacitor plates.

You can compute quantitatively (ignoring E field fringing effects, or plate area >> plate separation) by invoking virtual work. The E field is unchanged after the third plate is inserted but the volume per unit area is reduced due to the thickness of the third plate, so total field energy after the insertion is less than total field energy before insertion.

(BTW the same thing happens when you move a dielectric into the capacitor).

? How am I thinking about this wrong? E = V/d, d decreases and E becomes larger.
 
aspodkfpo said:
? How am I thinking about this wrong? E = V/d, d decreases and E becomes larger.
There is no more "d" after the central plate is inserted. There are two smaller "d"s, each smaller than d/2 since the central plate has finite thickness ##\delta##.

The fact that the E field does not change can be ascertained by showing that the charge densities on each inside face = Q/A or -Q/A, A = plate area, same as before, so that ## Q/(\epsilon_0 A) = ## E, the same before & after insertion.

Remember that we are ignoring fringing effects so if you know ##\sigma## on one inside surface you know that the E field is ##\sigma/\epsilon_0## all the way from one inside surface to the opposing inside surface. Plate separation enters the problem only if you want to compute potentials, which we don't need to (but just FYI the new V changes from Ed to E(d-##\delta##). )

So anyway you end up with the same E field but with smaller volume, changing from dA to ##(d-\delta)## A.

EDIT: Or you can go as follows:
Let unprimed = before 3rd plate insertion
primed = after insertion
Then,
## Q'=Q \Rightarrow C'V' = CV. ##
## C = \epsilon_0 A/d ##
## V = Ed ##
## C' = \epsilon_0 A/(d-\delta) ## (2 capacitors in series)
## V' = 2E'(d-\delta)/2 = E'(d-\delta) ##
So ## C'V' = CV \Rightarrow E'=E. ##
 
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