What Is the Acceleration Ratio a1/a3 in a Frictionless Block and Pulley System?

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Homework Help Overview

The discussion revolves around a frictionless block and pulley system, where the original poster seeks to determine the ratio of the magnitudes of the accelerations of two blocks, specifically a1/a3. The context involves applying Newton's second law, F=ma, to analyze the forces and accelerations in the system.

Discussion Character

  • Conceptual clarification, Mathematical reasoning, Assumption checking

Approaches and Questions Raised

  • The original poster attempts to derive the acceleration ratio using free body diagrams (FBD) for the blocks. Some participants question the dimensional consistency of the equations presented, particularly regarding the treatment of mass and acceleration.

Discussion Status

Participants are actively engaging in clarifying the importance of using correct units and maintaining dimensional consistency in equations. There is recognition of a fundamental error in the original poster's approach, and guidance has been offered to improve the understanding of the problem setup.

Contextual Notes

There is an emphasis on the need to consider the magnitudes of the accelerations, as well as the importance of including units in calculations. The original poster acknowledges the oversight regarding the terminology used in the problem statement.

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Homework Statement



The diagram shows a block and pulley
system where all the surfaces are
frictionless, and all the pulleys are
massless and frictionless.

Once all Blocks have been let go, what is the ratio of the magnitude of the acceleration, a1, of block 1
to the magnitude of the acceleration of Block 3, a3. That is, what is the ratio a1/a3 ?

nyinvm.jpg


Homework Equations



F=ma

The Attempt at a Solution



The answer is 2 but I get -2.

On block one FBD
m1 * a1 = T
a=T/m1 = T

FBD on block 3

-T=m3 * a3
a3=-T/m3
a3=-T/2

a1/a3 = -2


Any help would be awesome
 
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First of all, the question asks what the ratio of the MAGNITUDES of the accelerations is. Magnitudes are always positive.

Second, you can't write something like a1 = T/m1 = T. This is nonsense. m1 is not equal to 1.0 (a dimensionless number). It's equal to 1.0 kg, (a physical quantity, with dimensions of mass). You can't write an equation that says acceleration = force. You can't equate two different quantities that have different units. Your equations must be dimensionally consistent. You might think I'm just being picky, but I'm not. It's a fundamental error. You can only equate two physical quantities that have the same dimensions (a force to a force, a mass to a mass, an acceleration to an acceleration, etc.).
 
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Thanks.

I understand now, magnitude. Sometimes these words pass by without noticing.

also, you're right I probably should write the units. I always do in my written work but I thought everyone would understand what I meant when I shown the work here.

Thank you
 
NoobeAtPhysics said:
Thanks.

I understand now, magnitude. Sometimes these words pass by without noticing.

also, you're right I probably should write the units. I always do in my written work but I thought everyone would understand what I meant when I shown the work here.

Thank you

No problem. I just wanted to point this out because it is a basic error. Just to make sure it's clear: it's not just that you have to include units after you plug in the numbers. It's also your algebraic equation (with only symbols) that I was complaining about. Saying that a = T is actually wrong, and nonsensical (since you're equating an acceleration to a force). You must write a = T/m, even if m = 1.0 kg. You can't just omit the m, because it's a dimensional quantity, it's not just equal to unity. I hope that is clear.
 
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