Work done on a conical pendulum

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Homework Help Overview

The discussion revolves around a conical pendulum problem, focusing on the calculation of work done by the tension force in the context of the pendulum's motion. Participants are analyzing the relationships between tension, gravitational force, and the motion of the pendulum bob.

Discussion Character

  • Conceptual clarification, Assumption checking

Approaches and Questions Raised

  • The original poster attempts to determine the angle between the tension and the velocity at a given instant to evaluate the work done by the tension force. Some participants question the relationship between the tension and velocity vectors, particularly their orientations in the context of the pendulum's motion.

Discussion Status

Participants are exploring the implications of the tension being perpendicular to the velocity vector throughout the motion. There is a suggestion that this relationship may lead to the conclusion that the work done by the tension force is zero, although this is still under discussion.

Contextual Notes

There is an emphasis on understanding the geometry of the forces involved and how they relate to the motion of the pendulum. The discussion includes considerations of the assumptions made regarding the direction of forces and motion.

brotherbobby
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Homework Statement
The diagram below shows a conical pendulum of mass ##m##, length ##L## and vertical height ##h## rotating with uniform speed in a plane carving out a circle of radius ##r##. The tension in the (massless) wire is ##T##. Calculate the work done by the tension on the pendulum bob after one complete revolution.
Relevant Equations
1. Horizontal and vertical components of the tension force : ##T_V = T \cos \theta## and ##T_H = T \sin \theta##. (Please note the angle ##\theta## is the semi vertical angle - it is drawn or defined with respect the actual vector and the vertical, not the horizontal).

2. Newton's law for the acceleration of a body in an inertial frame : ##\vec a = \frac{\vec F}{m}##.

3. Centripetal force on a body moving with a speed ##\vec v## in rotational motion : ##\vec F = -\frac{mv^2}{r} \hat r##. (Please note that this value does not depend as to whether the rotational motion is uniform or non-uniform. In case of non-uniform motion, both ##\vec v## and ##\vec F## would be functions of time).
Conical Pendulum.png
The diagram for the problem is shown alongside. In the vertical (##\hat z##) direction we have ##T \cos \theta = mg##.

In the plane of the pendulum, if we take the pendulum bob at the left extreme end as shown in the diagram, we have ##T \sin \theta = \frac{mv^2}{r}## (the ##\hat x## axis of the pendulum is rotating along with it).

The first equation gives us the tension in the string in terms of the variables provided : ##T = mg \sec \theta = mg \frac{L}{h}##.

How to calculate the work done by the tension force ##-## this is where am stuck.

In particular, what is the angle that the tension has with the velocity ##\vec v## at a given instant? If I could find that angle, say some ##\alpha##, I can connect it to the semi-vertical angle ##\theta## as some ##\alpha (\theta)## and evaluate the work done by the tension by the line integral : ##W_T = \int_0^{2\pi} \vec T(\theta) \cdot d\vec l##, where ##d\vec l = \vec v dt## and the (uniform) speed can be connected to the tension, the radius of the pendulum and its mass from dividing the two equations above : ##v^2 = gr \tan \theta##.

##\color{blue}{Any\; help\; would\; be\; welcome}##.
 
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brotherbobby said:
what is the angle that the tension has with the velocity →vv→\vec v at a given instant
In the picture the ##\vec T## is clearly in the plane of the paper, whereas ##\vec v## is perpendicular to it, towards the viewer !
 
BvU said:
In the picture the ##\vec T## is clearly in the plane of the paper, whereas ##\vec v## is perpendicular to it, towards the viewer !

Yes indeed, sorry I should have realized it. What you mean is that even though the tension ##T(\theta)## is not along the ##\hat z## direction, it is nonetheless perpendicular to ##\vec v## at this instant?

And since this instant is the same as the next, if we keep rotating our plane of paper so that ##T(\theta)## always lies on it, the velocity vector ##\vec v## will be always perpendicular to the tension for the whole motion?

If that is true, am I right in assuming that the work done by the tension force ##T(\theta)## is 0?
 
Yes. There is no motion in the direction of ##\vec T##.
 

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