Would someone help with a flow simulation?

[Killavolt]

Hello all, I've come in search of some information, and hopefully if possible a little bit of help.
On searching the web for various ways to improve my truck in general I came across this very interesting mod that I've never once heard of in my entire life, "The Gadgetman Groove", which is a groove carved into the throttle body of a vehicle behind the throttle plate to create a vortex of air.
I've also discovered another "version" of this where instead of the groove, they shave off the edge of the throttle plate to be more wing shaped at the bottom.

As an electromechanical engineering technician this intrigues me greatly, not for the supposed claims of better mpg, but the science and theory behind it.

So I was curious if there is someone out there who could create a basic flow simulation of a pipe with a throttle plate and these 2 types of grooves so I could see visually how the air would actually flow and if there actually any improvements at all.

I would like to try it myself for s**** and giggles but if I did I want to have it done on a CNC with a very precise groove and not the chewed up junk this guy has been making.

however he isn't exactly very clear (to me anyway) in his diagrams and stuff. Here's a video of the first mod, it's his training video, but if you skip through it a bit you can see his diagrams of the mod and how it's done.
I would like to know what angle, depth, and curvature the groove would need for optimal performance.


And here is the video fo the guy modifying the throttle plate itself instead of the body.
so would anyone be willing to make a flow simulation of these for visual purposes?

 

[Mech_Engineer]

Most of what I'm seeing online tends to make me think this is another hoax in-line with other fads like the "vortex" throttle body modifications from the days of yore.

I recommend reviewing this article carefully before proceeding: https://auto.howstuffworks.com/fuel-efficiency/fuel-saving-devices/10-fuel-saving-device-hoaxes2.htm

The main warning flag with vortex generators is that they're actually based on antiquated engine technology. Automobiles built before engine management computers became commonplace did rely on the shape and length of intake bodies to manipulate fuel and air mixing. But modern vehicles have computers that constantly adjust fuel flow to match airflow: Create a turbulent airflow in the intake (as a vortex generator does), and the car simply adjusts the amount of fuel it injects [source: http://www.fuelsaving.info/debunk.htm].

 

[Killavolt]

let me make it completely clear, I'm not buying into any of the extreme mileage claims or anything of that nature, I'm just curious about the flow dynamics.
I'd be very curious to see what the difference actually is visually, and really what it looks like in it's stock configuration.

I'd be cheap and easy enough to pickup a throttle body from the wreckers and machine it out by hand as that guy does and test it out.
I kind of want to build a small smoke tunnel to test a few things, just to see it.
I could care less about their snake oil claims, I just like to see how things work and there are pretty much no videos of this nature that I was able to find.

 

[jrmichler]

Here's a discussion of the Gadgetman Groove with some results: http://ecomodder.com/forum/showthread.php/gadgetman-groove-experience-25758.html.

And here's a discussion of how to actually improve real world gas mileage in a pickup truck: http://ecomodder.com/forum/showthread.php/modding-06-gmc-canyon-17070.html. It's not the only discussion, and other people have done better.

 

[Killavolt]

Here's a discussion of the Gadgetman Groove with some results: http://ecomodder.com/forum/showthread.php/gadgetman-groove-experience-25758.html.

And here's a discussion of how to actually improve real world gas mileage in a pickup truck: http://ecomodder.com/forum/showthread.php/modding-06-gmc-canyon-17070.html. It's not the only discussion, and other people have done better.

I came to a mechanical engineering forum because I was curious about he flow dynamics, because, as the title says I was hoping to find someone who would be willing to help with a flow simulation.

I didn't come here to discuss fuel economy, and as I stated above that is not my interest in this, I want to see and know how the air flows ... did I come to the right place or no?

 

[Mech_Engineer]

I didn't come here to discuss fuel economy, and as I stated above that is not my interest in this, I want to see and know how the air flows ... did I come to the right place or no?

The analysis you're asking for is a complex and time-consuming thing to do especially if you're trying to look at different throttle plate positions. It also requires expensive CFD software many of whom only have access to through work (therefore it would be frowned upon to do a pro bono analysis for some random guy on an internet forum using it).

If you want to learn more about throttle body flow characteristics, I recommend doing some research (maybe read a paper like this). It's important to keep in mind modern throttle bodies are designed to control and measure air flow precisely, because the engine intake, valve train, and fuel injectors are responsible for fuel mixing. There just isn't any sound scientific basis for a minor throttle body flow perturbation to increase overall engine efficiency on a fuel-injected engine.