Electromagnetic radiation effect on electric field?

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Discussion Overview

The discussion revolves around the effects of electromagnetic radiation on electric fields, exploring the nature of electromagnetic waves, their propagation, and their interaction with static electric fields. Participants examine concepts related to oscillating charged particles, the relationship between electric and magnetic fields, and the implications of these interactions in both classical and quantum contexts.

Discussion Character

  • Exploratory
  • Technical explanation
  • Conceptual clarification
  • Debate/contested

Main Points Raised

  • One participant describes electromagnetic radiation as a traveling disturbance in the electric field, questioning how it affects both the magnitude and direction of electric field vectors.
  • Another participant asserts that the electromagnetic field consists of interconnected electric (E) and magnetic (B) fields, which can be combined with static electric fields from nearby charges.
  • A participant proposes that electromagnetic radiation results from oscillating charged particles, noting that changes in the electric field propagate at the speed of light and create wave patterns.
  • Another participant challenges the simplicity of the previous description, introducing the concept of photons and discussing the implications of quantum mechanics on charged particles and their energy states.
  • A later reply discusses the concept of polarization, explaining how the sum of multiple wave solutions can lead to variations in the electric field vectors, including elliptical or circular patterns based on their orientation and phase relationships.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants express differing views on the nature of electromagnetic radiation and its effects on electric fields. While some agree on the basic principles of wave propagation and oscillating charges, others introduce complexities related to quantum mechanics and the behavior of photons, indicating that the discussion remains unresolved.

Contextual Notes

Participants highlight the dependence on classical and quantum interpretations of electromagnetic phenomena, suggesting that assumptions about the behavior of charged particles and their interactions may vary based on the context of the discussion.

Dace123
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Hi, just trying to better understand this concept of electromagnetic radiation.

My understanding thus far is that it is a traveling disturbance in the electric field. This picture here seems to help me see what is happening:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Electromagnetic_radiation#/media/File:Electromagneticwave3D.gif

My understanding of the electric field thus far is that at any given point in space, there is a magnitude and direction which will determine the force acting on a charged particle at that point. That magnitude in direction is computed as the sum of all contributions from other nearby particles (I guess either protons or electrons), based on their sign +/- and their position wrt to that point. Often I've seen the electric field be represented as this grid of pointing vectors. All that I think makes sense to me.

Anyway, back to my question. So what does this traveling disturbance through this grid of pointing vectors actually do? Does it affect both the magnitude and direction of the vectors? That gif I linked just shows a wave propagating, it doesn't show how it affects the electric field. Since each point on the electric field has both a direction and a magnitude, there are 2 things it could affect. My guess right now is that it just affects the magnitude of the electric field vectors, but it does it change their direction also?
 
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What you see in the gif IS the electromagnetic field. The blue guys are the B field and the red guys are the E field. They are completely connected with each other through the Maxwell equations. If - from e.g. a fixed charge in the neighborhood - there is a static electric field you can simply add up the vectors from that field and the E vector of the passing electromagnetic wave.
 
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Thanks for the reply, would the following description be accurate? Electromagnetic radiation is just a by-product of oscillating a charged particle. That is, when you move a charge, it changes the electric field, but that change in the electric field propagates outward from the charge at the speed of light, it doesn't change every point on the electric field immediately. If you move the charge up and down, this creates a wave pattern.

Is the gif I linked basically doing the exact same effect as this simulation, when you press the "sinusoidal" button?

https://phet.colorado.edu/sims/radiating-charge/radiating-charge_en.html
 
Dace123 said:
Thanks for the reply, would the following description be accurate? Electromagnetic radiation is just a by-product of oscillating a charged particle.

It isn't that simple because light comes in discreet packets of energy called photons. Some great physicists noted that if light was simply created by oscillating charges then electrons in orbit around atoms would constantly lose their energy and fall inward. Charged particles are small things so they are governed by quantum phenomena. On large scale, yes you can create a disturbance in the electric field or magnetic field and it will propagate as a wave through space. Essentially that's an antenna.
 
Dace123 said:
My guess right now is that it just affects the magnitude of the electric field vectors, but it does it change their direction also?
The sum of two or more solutions is also a solution, and one simple way this can vary is known as polarization. There are for example specific polarized combinations which appear to rotate left or right. If two linearly polarized waves (as in the original gif) have the same frequency but their field vectors are oriented in different directions relative to the direction of travel and are out of phase, then the components of the field vector can trace an ellipse or a circle about the line of travel. One can alternatively consider a linearly polarized wave to be mathematically a sum of equal left and right circularly polarized waves.
 

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