Extremely freaked out. Climbed some sort of antenna.

[willrr1]

Hey guys,

Last night around 12 midnight, I decided it would be a good idea to climb a nearby antenna next to my house. It is about 143 meters high, and I went all the way to the top.

However, I have been googling around, and I think I might have climbed an AM tower antenna, and I am REALLY freaked out that I might have received some sort of harmful radiation.

Those are some pictures. I had to climb up the inside of the tower. There were no dishes on it or anything. And at the top, as you can see in the picture, it is just flat.

I have tried to find information on the tower, and I sent some people emails but they aren't registered anymore.

Twr 1 - 900 E Ledbetter (Lat: 32.944722 Lon: -96.940278), Type: 4ta1, Structure height: 143.3 m, Overall height: 145 m, , Licensee ID: L00012983
Registrant: Krbe Co Dba , 140 E Market St, York, PA 17401, Phone: (717) 848-5500,

That is one of the towers in the area that I might have climbed. There were about 3 of them and I just randomly chose one. I don't know how to look up anything based on that Licensee ID either.

Can anyone help me out? I am really concerned. I took my cell phone with me and it is fine, and I never heard any buzzing of any sort or got shocked. And there were no warning signs that were actually legible, they have all been faded.

Thanks

 

[dlgoff]

I'm thinking that had there been a transmitting antenna, you would not be making this post. You are very lucky.

My advice... Stay away from them.

 

[willrr1]

Here is a picture of all of them together.

I realize that this was a stupid thing to do. I am glad that I didn't get electrocuted, but now I'm just concerned about radiation.

 

[dlgoff]

I'm not sure but it's possible that this is AM radio beam antenna. And it could have been transmitting. It's hard to see if there is a feed to one of them. Is there anything that looks like http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:Base_feed.spliced.jpg" ?

Again, you were lucky. As to any radiation damage you may of suffered, I have no idea.

BTW

https://www.physicsforums.com/showthread.php?t=5374"

 

[willrr1]

Yes, there was a large box right by the tower. I'm pretty sure it is an AM tower because I managed to find some info on the licensee and it said those towers are an AM array.

There was no hum from the box, and everything around it look old. There was no heat or anything from the tower all the way up. And I directly touched the tower while I was still standing on the ground, no shock.

Hopefully if it was going to do some damage, I would have at least felt some heat or have been burned. I feel perfectly fine, I just have scars from the barbed wire fence.

Again, very stupid idea. Thanks for the info about the forum rules, I accidentally disregarded that in my frantic state. And thanks for the help so far!

 

[waht]

I was once in an AM radio station, and the shack where the host had a studio was like 30 ft away from the first antenna array, which looked almost the same as in your pics. They said it was completely safe.

 

[dlgoff]

I was once in an AM radio station, and the shack where the host had a studio was like 30 ft away from the first antenna array, which looked almost the same as in your pics. They said it was completely safe.

A little different than being on the antenna. I bet "his" station wasn't transmitting.

 

[willrr1]

Well thanks guys. I feel a lot better about it now.

I think I escaped any acute damage. I really doubt I'll have any long term damage since I bet the thing wasn't even on.

I'll sleep a lot better tonight!

 

[skeptic2]

Here is a link to the license which has been canceled.

http://wireless2.fcc.gov/UlsApp/UlsSearch/license.jsp?licKey=1021948

This is the only license I can find for this location so it looks like the tower is no longer being used.

It was not an AM station but operating on 957.95 MHz at 3800 watts. Had you gotten in front of that antenna when it was operating, it could have been a lot worse than had it been an AM station.

 

[Antiphon]

You would not have survived close proximity to a 50,000 watt am or fm transmitting antenna. It's not ionizing radiation so you won't die days later like with a nuclear reactor. It's a high electric field which would have disoriented you and you would have fallen to your death.

 

[DaveC426913]

Where can I read about these dangers? I tried Googling 'AM transmission tower dangers' but get little in the way of useful hits.

 

[TurtleMeister]

Here is an online RF safety calculator. Just plug in the variables and the program will tell you the RF power density and whether it meets FCC safety standards.

http://hintlink.com/power_density.htm

 

[willrr1]

Thanks Skeptic and others.

I was browsing a lot of BASE jumping forums, where there was a huge outcry to stay away from AM towers. No one could explain why either, they just said it was bad.

The area around the tower was pretty much trashed. I think the red lights are the only thing that is operating on it.

There is a lot of fear of RF radiation from antenna climbers and BASE jumpers. I don't think it is quite warranted now.

I was driving home from work around 12 midnight and for some reason I decided I needed to climb that antenna. It was a 100% impulsive decision. I'll write back in 20 years or so if my kids have 4 arms or 2 heads.

 

[Ali Inam]

I remember reading somewhere that it is the mobile phone towers that are extremely harmful for the living, but it does depend upon the frequencies, doesn't it ? !


AM towers have lower frequency I think

 

[skeptic2]

I'll write back in 20 years or so if my kids have 4 arms or 2 heads.

Just this past week I was talking to a guy who used to replace lights on towers while they were transmitting. He did mention all his kids turned out normal.

I remember reading somewhere that it is the mobile phone towers that are extremely harmful for the living, but it does depend upon the frequencies, doesn't it ? !AM towers have lower frequency I think

Don't believe everything you read. There have been many, many studies on the safety of cellular towers and none of the reputable ones have indicated any danger. This is why the FCC does not allow that reason to be used in hearings about erection of cellular towers.

Instead of just repeating dubious conclusions from unreliable sources, why don't you educate yourself by researching the issue for yourself. You could start by going to the FCC's site and finding out what they have to say about RF safety. Then you could plug the values for cell base stations into the link in post #12 and see for yourself in cell towers are dangerous. (Hint: when I was designing cellular base station transmitters we were putting out about 20 watts at 900 MHz.)

 

[DaveC426913]

Here is an online RF safety calculator. Just plug in the variables and the program will tell you the RF power density and whether it meets FCC safety standards.

http://hintlink.com/power_density.htm

That doesn't tell me anything about the dangers.

 

[dlgoff]

Here you go DaveC426913.
http://www.fcc.gov/oet/rfsafety/rf-faqs.html"

 

[Averagesupernova]

I happen to know someone who went up an AM transmitting tower operating at 1520 kHz while it was transmitting. I believe the transmitter was putting out around 1500 watts. This power range is very common for AM. I believe the antenna (tower itself) was shunt fed with a wire that angled up from probably 30 feet away to a height of 30 to 40 feet. This is quite a while ago so I'm not completely sure of the distance/height. I am not certain of the reason he went up but I suspect to inspect the point where the feed wire attaches to the tower. I also recall him saying that he fixed some broken wires (radials) buried around the antenna that formed a ground plane. He claimed that as he reconnected them he noticed arcing between the ends. As far as I know he still works in the broadcast field. (Probably literally)

 

[DaveC426913]

Here you go DaveC426913.
http://www.fcc.gov/oet/rfsafety/rf-faqs.html"

That wasn't as informative as I would have liked.

 

[dlgoff]

That wasn't as informative as I would have liked.

Sorry. That's the best I could find.

 

[DaveC426913]

Sorry. That's the best I could find.

Not your failing.

I was really hoping for a basis upon which some of these claims are being made here, such as becoming disoriented.

I know very little about high-power transmissions from towers and wanted to understand the effects on the human body.

 

[shoehorn]

The practical dangers associated with being in close proximity to high-power RF antennas are all concerned with burns caused by arcing current conducted through the body. In theory, RF is capable of producing disorientation and sterility but I'd be far more worried about becoming a conductor than whether my children will have more than the optimal number of heads.

I had an induction on this years ago when I did an internship at a defence contractor in the US but I can't recall the specific guidelines we were issued. That said, the OSHA has an interesting example of what happened to a group of painters on an RF tower http://www.osha.gov/SLTC/radiofrequencyradiation/sears.pdf.

 

[DaveC426913]

I had an induction on this years ago

That's punny.



Thanks. Those were very helpful.

 

[vk6kro]

Antennas for most frequencies are relatively small and are supported by the tower or mast.
In this case, the antenna has been removed and the first photo is of the mounting bracket for the antenna.

If there had been an operating dish there, it is hard to have much sympathy for someone who climbed 143 meters to put his head in front of it. The effect would be pretty much like getting inside a microwave oven.

For the AM broadcast band (1 MHz +/- 0.5 MHz) the tower is the antenna. It is usually fed at the bottom and insulated from ground. A buried network of metallic conductors is an important part of the antenna. Some of the supporting wires may also form part of the antenna where they are connected at the top of the vertical structure.

The feedpoint at the bottom is at low impedance, but the high power involved means this can still be fed at a high voltage.
A 10 KW transmitter feeding an antenna at 50 ohms would be producing 707 volts rms.

A much greater danger in this case was that this site has been abandoned for 12 years, so there could be missing or rusted bolts or guy wires which would weaken the mast and possibly allow it to fall over taking the (presumably) intoxicated climber with it.

 

[DaveC426913]

... taking the (presumably) intoxicated climber with it.

The dangers are legion...

I was driving home from work around 12 midnight and for some reason I decided I needed to climb that antenna.

 

[Averagesupernova]

If there had been an operating dish there, it is hard to have much sympathy for someone who climbed 143 meters to put his head in front of it.

A much greater danger in this case was that this site has been abandoned for 12 years, so there could be missing or rusted bolts or guy wires which would weaken the mast and possibly allow it to fall over taking the (presumably) intoxicated climber with it.

So if you have no sympathy why should you care if a 'presumed' drunk climber falls to his death?

 

[vk6kro]

A much greater danger in this case was that this site has been abandoned for 12 years, so there could be missing or rusted bolts or guy wires which would weaken the mast and possibly allow it to fall over taking the (presumably) intoxicated climber with it.

I don't think that says whether I care or not. It is a discussion of risk due to mechanical failure of an old tower.

In fact, I value all human life very much. That is why I am trying to discourage others from climbing high radio masts, particularly at night.

 

[DaveC426913]

I was too subtle.

The OP did say that he was driving home when he decided to climb the tower. Let's hope he was not impaired.

 

[Averagesupernova]

I caught it Dave. I have known plenty of people who would do things like this sober.

 

[gnurf]

I have known plenty of people who would do things like this sober.

...but they didn't hang around for very long after the antennas began transmitting?

 

[willrr1]

A much greater danger in this case was that this site has been abandoned for 12 years, so there could be missing or rusted bolts or guy wires which would weaken the mast and possibly allow it to fall over taking the (presumably) intoxicated climber with it.

Haha. No I was sober. I felt like I needed a change in my life, as the routine is getting old. There was quite a bit of rust at the bottom of the antenna, and the box beside it looked very beat up and had some graffiti on it.

What a surreal experience it would have been if the whole tower fell down while I was at the very top. That scenario reminds me of the very end of the movie 'Fight Club'.

I have read many stories of people becoming disoriented and feeling a lot of heat coming from AM arrays, but I have never understood why.

This whole situation has peaked my interest in climbing other structures. I think I might have sparked up something that I have been holding back for all these years.

Thanks a lot for all the replies guys.

 

[Averagesupernova]

...but they didn't hang around for very long after the antennas began transmitting?

Hmmmm, well I guess you didn't read my first post in this thread. What I meant by knowing people that would do this is the fact that they would climb a structure for the heck of it. Not limited to a radio tower or anything like that. My comment was directed at VK6KRO intending to point out that a person does not have to be drunk to climb a tall structure at night. There are plenty of people willing to do that for the thrill the same way there are people willing to jump out of airplanes in hopes that the chute opens.

 

[MATLABdude]

When I was back in junior high, I recall reading about the EA-6B Prowler, and recall coming across the statement in one of those big coffee-table illustrated books that the canopy was gold-tinted (looking back, probably a thin film of gold or copper thicker than the skin depth) to ensure that the crew wouldn't get cooked by the output of the jammers. Anybody have any insights?
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/EA-6B_Prowler

 

[vk6kro]

This whole situation has peaked my interest in climbing other structures. I think I might have sparked up something that I have been holding back for all these years.

There was a story on TV of a guy in Australia who got bored with base-jumping off cliffs and gliding away from them, so he has started flying along the cliffs, trying to stay about 10 ft from the cliff. He only uses the parachute at the last minute when he is close to the ground.

He expects to die young. Most of his friends have.

I find it interesting that you think nothing of climbing a mast as high as a 47 floor building at night, but are "extremely freaked out" at the possible radiation from an abandoned mast with no antenna on it.

Is your life really so boring that you need to do stuff like this?

 

[willrr1]

I find it interesting that you think nothing of climbing a mast as high as a 47 floor building at night, but are "extremely freaked out" at the possible radiation from an abandoned mast with no antenna on it.

Is your life really so boring that you need to do stuff like this?

What does radiation have to do with heights? I am not afraid of heights, hence why I thought it would be fun. (And it was)

Does my life have to be boring in order to do something like this?

I don't understand any of your logic.