Inverting a Tensor - How to Find Out?

  • Context: Graduate 
  • Thread starter Thread starter tulip
  • Start date Start date
  • Tags Tags
    Tensor
Click For Summary

Discussion Overview

The discussion revolves around the invertibility of a tensor defined by specific components involving two invertible matrices, R and S. Participants explore whether a general rule exists for determining the existence of an inverse for this tensor, as well as the implications of certain cases where the tensor may not be invertible.

Discussion Character

  • Debate/contested
  • Mathematical reasoning

Main Points Raised

  • One participant defines the tensor components and seeks to determine if an inverse exists, questioning whether a determinant-like rule applies to tensors.
  • Another participant argues that the tensor is generally not invertible, providing examples where specific choices of R and S lead to the tensor being the null tensor.
  • A different participant challenges the assertion of non-invertibility, noting that while certain cases lead to a zero tensor, this does not imply that the tensor is generally non-invertible.
  • Further clarification is provided that if there exists any case where the tensor is not invertible, then a general theorem or algorithm for inversion cannot be established, suggesting that the invertibility must be assessed on a case-by-case basis.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants express disagreement regarding the generality of the tensor's invertibility. While some assert that it is generally non-invertible, others argue that this conclusion cannot be drawn without considering specific cases of R and S.

Contextual Notes

The discussion highlights the limitations in establishing a general rule for the invertibility of the tensor, emphasizing the dependence on the specific values of the matrices involved.

tulip
Messages
6
Reaction score
0
Thank you for reading.

If I have an object (is it correct to call it a tensor?) whose components are defined by:

[tex]X_{mikl}=(R^{-1})_{mi}R_{kl}-(S^{-1})_{mi}S_{kl},[/tex]

where R and S are invertible matrices. I want to find the "inverse" of X, i.e. to find (X^{-1}) such that,

[tex](X^{-1})_{qkpm}X_{mikl}=\delta_{lq}\delta_{pi}[/tex].

Is there a way to find out whether (X^{-1}) exists? A matrix doesn't have an inverse if its determinant is zero - is there a similar rule here? I've tried some trial functions for X^{-1} but nothing works, and I want to know whether there's a better way of tackling this problem.
 
Physics news on Phys.org
With no further constraints the tensor you have proposed is, in general, not invertible.

Consider for example the case [tex]R=S[/tex]. Then [tex]X[/tex] will be the null tensor. Or even the less trivial case [tex]R=S^{-1}[/tex] will lead also to [tex]X=0[/tex] if [tex]R^2=1[/tex] (idempotent).

Therefore, in general, it is not invertible.
 
Last edited:
R is not equal to S, or to the inverse of S. It is clearly true that for special cases where X=0 there is no inverse, but I don't see how this tells us that X is generally non-invertible. Can you explain?
 
If for the problem stated there are cases where X is not invertible (even if there is just one of such cases) then it can not exist a theorem, a result, or an algorithm which allows us to invert the given expression with generelity, i.e. regardless of the values of R and S, (i.e., operating with "letters" in full generality insted of with "numbers"). Hence, the invertibility or not of X will depend on the particular values of R and S, and so we say that "in general" X is not invertible.

So, the meaning of "in general X is not invertible" is not "X is non-invertible more often than not"; the meaning is actually "the invertibility of X has to be determined on a particular case basis, it can not be determined generally (no matter the values of R and S)"
 
Last edited:

Similar threads

  • · Replies 2 ·
Replies
2
Views
3K
  • · Replies 1 ·
Replies
1
Views
4K
Replies
3
Views
2K
  • · Replies 6 ·
Replies
6
Views
2K
  • · Replies 5 ·
Replies
5
Views
3K
  • · Replies 2 ·
Replies
2
Views
3K
  • · Replies 1 ·
Replies
1
Views
3K
  • · Replies 13 ·
Replies
13
Views
2K
  • · Replies 17 ·
Replies
17
Views
7K
  • · Replies 2 ·
Replies
2
Views
1K