The Magnitude of Induced EMF in a Moving Rod?

AI Thread Summary
The discussion focuses on calculating the induced electromotive force (emf) in a moving metal rod within a magnetic field. The key point is that the correct method involves taking the scalar product of the velocity vector crossed with the magnetic field vector and then multiplying by the length vector, rather than performing a cross product with the length. Participants clarify that only the relevant components of the vectors contribute to the scalar product, leading to the correct magnitude of the induced emf. The misunderstanding stemmed from confusion over vector operations, particularly the scalar product and its implications on the components involved. The discussion concludes with a resolution of the confusion regarding vector operations and their application in this context.
DottZakapa
Messages
239
Reaction score
17
Homework Statement
A 25.0 cm long metal rod lies in the xy-plane and makes an angle of 36.9 with the positive x-axis and an angle of 53.1 with the positive y-axis. the rod is moving in the +x-direction with a speed of 6.80 m/s. the rod is in a uniform magnetic field B= (0.120T)i-(0.220T)j-(0.0900T)k .
What is the magnitude of the emf induced in the rod? indicate in sketch which end of the rod is at higher potential.
Relevant Equations
induced emf
Homework Statement: A 25.0 cm long metal rod lies in the xy-plane and makes an angle of 36.9 with the positive x-axis and an angle of 53.1 with the positive y-axis. the rod is moving in the +x-direction with a speed of 6.80 m/s. the rod is in a uniform magnetic field B= (0.120T)i-(0.220T)j-(0.0900T)k .
What is the magnitude of the emf induced in the rod? indicate in sketch which end of the rod is at higher potential.
Homework Equations: induced emf

emf =VxBxL
i have done first
vxB= (6.8 m/s i) x( (0.120T)i-(0.220T)j-(0.0900T)k)= (0.612j -1.496k)
next i split in components the length
0,25(cos 36.9 + sin 36.9)= 0.199 i+0.15j
then
(VxB)x(0.199 i+0.15j)=(0.612j -1.496k)x(0.199 i+0.15j)= (0.224i-0.297j-0.121k)

now getting the magnitude of this i don't get the right result. Can anyone explain to me why?
 
Physics news on Phys.org
DottZakapa said:
emf =VxBxL
Don't take the cross-product with L. Take the scalar product of ##\vec{v}\times \vec{B}## with ##\vec{L}##. (Note that EMF is a scalar.)
 
Doc Al said:
Don't take the cross-product with L. Take the scalar product of ##\vec{v}\times \vec{B}## with ##\vec{L}##. (Note that EMF is a scalar.)

Screen Shot 2019-08-28 at 19.18.21.png


this is how it should be solved, but i don't get why is so :oldconfused:
 
Is there a step you're not getting? The first step (labeled "Identify" in the given solution) is key and it's just what I had stated earlier. That's what you were doing wrong.

What textbook are you using?
 
Doc Al said:
What textbook are you using?

is a previous years exam solution
Doc Al said:
Is there a step you're not getting? .

what i am not getting is from this point on, the second passage doesn't match the first
Screen Shot 2019-08-28 at 20.31.14.png
 
Sorry, but I'm not seeing which passages don't match.
 
Doc Al said:
Sorry, but I'm not seeing which passages don't match.
it starts with this
Screen Shot 2019-08-28 at 22.09.12.png

then it splits ##\vec L## which is the length of the rod in vector components as follows
Screen Shot 2019-08-28 at 22.09.31.png

you said to not take the scalar product with ##\vec L##, so why is the length in vector components?how do you get this result below? this is what i am not getting. Where is (-1.496 ##\frac V m ##) ## \hat k ## gone?
Screen Shot 2019-08-28 at 22.09.42.png


what is that sin(36.9) doing there?
 
DottZakapa said:
you said to not take the scalar product with ##\vec L##, so why is the length in vector components?
No, I said not to take the cross product with ##\vec L##. (Which is what you were doing in your first post.) But do take the scalar product!
DottZakapa said:
how do you get this result below? this is what i am not getting. Where is (-1.496 ##\frac V m ##) ## \hat k ## gone?
Since ##\vec L## has no ## \hat k ## component, that term vanishes after taking the scalar product.
DottZakapa said:
what is that sin(36.9) doing there?
That's from taking the ## \hat j ## component of ##\vec L##. Note that only the ## \hat j ## components survive the scalar product.
 
  • Wow
Likes DottZakapa
Doc Al said:
No, I said not to take the cross product with ##\vec L##. (Which is what you were doing in your first post.) But do take the scalar product!

Since ##\vec L## has no ## \hat k ## component, that term vanishes after taking the scalar product.

That's from taking the ## \hat j ## component of ##\vec L##. Note that only the ## \hat j ## components survive the scalar product.
Damn now I understood where my problem is.
I had completely forgot how a scalar product works with vectors components.
I've just recalled this i⋅j=i⋅k=j⋅k=0 and i⋅i=j⋅j=k⋅k=1
😓
Now is all bright n clear.
Sorry man, thanks for your time and patient. very gentle.
 
Back
Top