Need help finding spring constant from volume, area, temperature and distance

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Homework Help Overview

The problem involves an ideal gas confined in a cylinder with a massless piston attached to a spring. Participants are tasked with finding the spring constant and the final temperature of the gas after heating, given initial conditions such as pressure, volume, and temperature.

Discussion Character

  • Exploratory, Assumption checking, Problem interpretation

Approaches and Questions Raised

  • Participants discuss the relationship between pressure, volume, and temperature in the context of the ideal gas law, questioning how to derive the spring constant without explicit values for pressure. Some suggest that the spring constant may not be necessary for solving the problem.

Discussion Status

There is ongoing exploration of expressions for pressure in terms of other variables, with some participants indicating that certain variables will cancel out in the final calculations. Guidance has been provided on how to approach the problem without needing to find the spring constant directly.

Contextual Notes

Participants note that the initial pressure is not given explicitly, and there is a focus on deriving relationships between the variables rather than calculating specific values. The discussion reflects uncertainty about the necessity of the spring constant in the solution process.

defmar
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An ideal gas is confined to a cylinder by a massless piston that is attached to an ideal spring. Outside the cylinder is a vacuum. The cross-sectional area of the piston is A = 2.50*10^-3 m^2. The initial pressure, volume, and temperature of the gas are, respectively, P0, V0 = 6.00*10^-4 m^3 and T0 = 273 K, and the spring is initially stretched by an amount x0 = 0.800 m with respect to its unstrained length. The gas is heated, so that its final pressure, volume, and temperature are Pf, Vf and Tf and the spring is stretched by an amount xf = 0.1000 m with respect to its unstrained length. What is the final temperature of the gas?

For the life of me, I cannot find the spring constant k that is needed to solve the rest of the entire problem. I know that KE = (3/2)kT, but I don't know KE either. I'm not given the initial pressure, just the variable. Anyone able to help me find k? I'm lost on how to come up with it.
 
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defmar said:
An ideal gas is confined to a cylinder by a massless piston that is attached to an ideal spring. Outside the cylinder is a vacuum. The cross-sectional area of the piston is A = 2.50*10^-3 m^2. The initial pressure, volume, and temperature of the gas are, respectively, P0, V0 = 6.00*10^-4 m^3 and T0 = 273 K, and the spring is initially stretched by an amount x0 = 0.800 m with respect to its unstrained length.
You can't solve for k or n. But you do not have to find k or n.

Just write the expression for P0 in terms of x0, A, V0, n and T0 and similarly write the expression for Pf . When you solve for Tf you will see that k and n drop out.

AM
 
Andrew Mason said:
You can't solve for k or n. But you do not have to find k or n.

Just write the expression for P0 in terms of x0, A, V0, n and T0 and similarly write the expression for Pf . When you solve for Tf you will see that k and n drop out.

AM

Thank you.

I'm getting T_f = [T_0*(V_0+A*ΔX)*X_f/A] / [(X_0*V_0)/A] solving :)
 
defmar said:
Thank you.

I'm getting T_f = [T_0*(V_0+A*ΔX)*X_f/A] / [(X_0*V_0)/A] solving :)
What is Δx?

What is your expression for P in terms of k, x and A? What is Pf/P0?

What is Pf/P0 in terms of Tf, T0, Vf and V0?

Work out Tf from that.

AM
 

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