Spinor product in Peskin-Schroeder problem 5.3

  • Context: Graduate 
  • Thread starter Thread starter Manu_
  • Start date Start date
  • Tags Tags
    Product Spinor
Click For Summary

Discussion Overview

The discussion revolves around problem 5.3 from Peskin and Schroeder, specifically focusing on the Fierz identity related to spinor products. Participants are exploring the derivation and implications of this identity within the context of quantum field theory, particularly concerning left-handed and right-handed spinors.

Discussion Character

  • Technical explanation
  • Debate/contested
  • Homework-related

Main Points Raised

  • Emmanuel expresses confusion about identifying the forms of the vectors \( V^{\mu} \) and \( W^{\mu} \) in the Fierz identity, suggesting \( V^{\mu} = u_{L}(p_{2})\bar{u}_{L}(p_1) \) and \( W^{\mu} = u_{R}(p_{1})\bar{u}_{R}(p_2) \).
  • Some participants reference external materials, such as books by Atkinson and Radovanovic, for Fierz transformations, but there is uncertainty about their applicability to the specific problem at hand.
  • Emmanuel questions the definition of a spinor product involving right-handed and left-handed spinors, specifically \( s(p_1,p_2)=\bar{v}_{R}(p_1) u_{L}(p_2) \), and whether this is valid given the context of the problem.
  • There is a suggestion to consult a solution manual, but Emmanuel notes that it does not provide clarity, stating that the solution is presented as "obvious."
  • Participants mention that the textbooks do not specifically address the use of Fierz identities with spinor products as needed for this problem.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants generally express uncertainty and confusion regarding the application of Fierz identities and the definitions of spinor products. There is no consensus on how to proceed with the problem or the validity of certain approaches.

Contextual Notes

Participants note limitations in available resources, as the references provided do not directly address the specific application of Fierz identities to spinor products as required in the problem. There is also an acknowledgment of missing steps in the derivation process.

Who May Find This Useful

This discussion may be useful for students and researchers working on quantum field theory, particularly those grappling with spinor algebra and Fierz transformations in the context of particle physics problems.

Manu_
Messages
12
Reaction score
1
Hello,

I am currently stuck on problem 5.3 (c) about spinor products in PS, where one needs to prove the Fierz identity:
$$ \bar{u}_{L}(p_{1}) \gamma^{\mu} {u}_{L}(p_{2}) [\gamma_{\mu}]_{ab} = 2 [u_{L}(p_{2})\bar{u}_{L}(p_1) +u_{R}(p_{1})\bar{u}_{R}(p_2) ]_{ab} $$
They say that a Dirac matric M satisfies:
$$ \gamma^{5} [M]=-[M]\gamma^{5}$$
hence should be of the form:
$$ [M]= \left( \frac{1-\gamma^{5}}{2} \right) \gamma_{\mu} V^{\mu} + \left( \frac{1+\gamma^{5}}{2} \right) \gamma_{\mu} W^{\mu} $$

But then, to get the answer, I suppose that:
$$ V^{\mu} = u_{L}(p_{2})\bar{u}_{L}(p_1) $$
$$ W^{\mu} = u_{R}(p_{1})\bar{u}_{R}(p_2) $$
Honestly, I don't see exactly why. Can someone point me out the way to make this identification?

Next, in part (d), we should get an amplitude of the form:
$$ i\mathcal{M} = (-ie)^{2} \bar{v}_{R} (k_{2}) \gamma^{\mu} u_{R} (k_{1}) \frac{-i}{s} \bar{u}_{R}(p_{1})\gamma_{\nu} v_{R}(p_2)$$
Thus, we have terms in u and v. However, all the spinor product formalism has been developed in terms of u. My question is: can one define a spinor product $$s(p_1,p_2)=\bar{v}_{R}(p_1) u_{L}(p_2) $$?

Thanks,
Emmanuel
 
Physics news on Phys.org
All these messy calculations involving Fierz transformations identities can be found in the books by Atkinson's and Radovanovic's.
 
Thanks for the references, MathematicalPhysicist.
But I took a look on these books, and all I saw was the general Fierz identities, and these are already treated in PS.
However, I still don't see where does this result come from. I'm sure it's something basic, but I can't see it...
 
Does anyone else have a suggestion?
Thanks!
 
Hi!
Yes, I have seen this manual, but unfortunately, he states that this is all obvious...
 
  • Like
Likes   Reactions: MathematicalPhysicist
Hi @Manu_ , have you tried the exercises textbook of Atkinson's?
 
Hi!
I took a look in this book and Radovanovic's, but they cover more or less what has been treated in P&S before problem 5.3. They do not mention Fierz identities used with spinor products.
 

Similar threads

  • · Replies 1 ·
Replies
1
Views
2K
  • · Replies 3 ·
Replies
3
Views
2K
  • · Replies 1 ·
Replies
1
Views
2K
  • · Replies 6 ·
Replies
6
Views
4K
  • · Replies 2 ·
Replies
2
Views
2K
  • · Replies 38 ·
2
Replies
38
Views
6K
  • · Replies 15 ·
Replies
15
Views
4K
  • · Replies 4 ·
Replies
4
Views
3K
  • · Replies 49 ·
2
Replies
49
Views
7K
  • · Replies 2 ·
Replies
2
Views
8K