Why do F- and OH- have negative S values?

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Discussion Overview

The discussion revolves around the negative entropy (S) values of fluoride (F-) and hydroxide (OH-) ions, specifically in the context of aqueous solutions. Participants explore the implications of these values and seek to understand the reasoning behind them.

Discussion Character

  • Exploratory, Technical explanation, Conceptual clarification

Main Points Raised

  • One participant questions the significance of the negative S values without specifying the context, such as whether it pertains to aqueous or gas phase conditions.
  • Another participant clarifies that their inquiry is not homework-related but stems from curiosity about the negative S values in their reference material.
  • A suggestion is made to investigate the thermodynamic properties of ions further, noting that entropy values are relative to assigned zero values for the formation of H+ ions.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants do not reach a consensus on the implications of the negative S values, and multiple perspectives on the context and significance of these values are presented.

Contextual Notes

The discussion lacks specific definitions and assumptions regarding the conditions under which the entropy values are considered, and the reference points for the assigned zero values are not fully elaborated.

MaddenDude
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Why do F- and OH- have negative S values? (Entropy)

And are they the only ones with negative S values?
 
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The question isn't too meaningful without a context: aqueous? gas phase? Homework?
 
aqueous; its not homework, I'm just curious. In my book, all the S values are positive except those two, I'm just wondering why.
 
Snoop around in the discussion of thermodynamic properties of ions a little more --- you'll find that they are relative to arbitrarily assigned zero values for H+ formation.
 

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