Ideals and commutative rings with unity

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Homework Help Overview

The discussion revolves around the properties of ideals in the context of commutative rings with unity, specifically examining the relationship between the intersection of two ideals and their product.

Discussion Character

  • Conceptual clarification, Mathematical reasoning, Problem interpretation

Approaches and Questions Raised

  • Participants explore the double inclusion of the intersection of two ideals A and B with their product AB. They discuss specific cases to show A ∩ B ⊆ AB and A ∩ B ⊇ AB, raising questions about the clarity and necessity of certain steps in their reasoning.

Discussion Status

Some participants provide feedback on the clarity of the arguments presented, suggesting improvements in the exposition of ideas. There is an ongoing exploration of the reasoning behind the steps taken, with no explicit consensus reached on the correctness of the arguments.

Contextual Notes

Participants note the importance of the properties of the ring being commutative with unity, which influences their reasoning about the ideals involved.

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Homework Statement



From contemporary abstract algebra :

http://gyazo.com/08def13b62b0512a23505811bcc1e37e

Homework Equations



"A subring A of a ring R is called a (two-sided) ideal of R if for every r in R and every a in A both ra and ar are in A."

So I know that since A and B are ideals of a ring R, ar, ra \in A and br, rb \in B for all a \in A, \space b \in B, \space r \in R

The Attempt at a Solution



So my guess is to argue the double inclusion for this.

Case : A \cap B \subseteq AB

Suppose k \in A \cap B, then k \in A and k \in B. We want to show k \in AB

I'm having trouble seeing how the given facts are supposed to steer the argument from here. Help would be much appreciated.
 
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Hmm I thought about this for an hour or so... and I THINK I may be on to something. I'll continue my flow below :

Case : A \cap B \subseteq AB

Suppose k \in A \cap B, then k \in A and k \in B. We want to show k \in AB.

Since we know R is a commutative ring with unity, let e denote the unity in R.

Now since R = A + B, we know that e = a + b for some a \in A and b \in B. Now :

e = a + b
ke = k(a + b)
k = ka + kb

Hence ka \in A and kb \in B hence k \in A + B

We can take a \in A and we can take k \in B. We can also take b \in B and we can take k \in A. Putting these together we have ka \in AB and kb \in AB so that k \in AB since a \in A and b \in B as desired.

∴ A \cap B \subseteq ABCase : A \cap B \supseteq AB

Let ab \in AB

Now, ab \in A since a \in A, b \in R and A is an ideal of R. Also, ab \in B since b \in B, a \in R and B is an ideal of R. Hence ab \in A \cap B.

∴ A \cap B \supseteq AB

∴ A \cap B = AB

I think that's it... If someone could look over it for me and tell me maybe if I missed something or if it's completely wrong that would be great :).
 
Zondrina said:
Hmm I thought about this for an hour or so... and I THINK I may be on to something. I'll continue my flow below :

Case : A \cap B \subseteq AB

Suppose k \in A \cap B, then k \in A and k \in B. We want to show k \in AB.

Since we know R is a commutative ring with unity, let e denote the unity in R.

Now since R = A + B, we know that e = a + b for some a \in A and b \in B. Now :

e = a + b
ke = k(a + b)
k = ka + kb

Hence ka \in A and kb \in B hence k \in A + B

We can take a \in A and we can take k \in B. We can also take b \in B and we can take k \in A. Putting these together we have ka \in AB and kb \in AB so that k \in AB since a \in A and b \in B as desired.

∴ A \cap B \subseteq AB


Case : A \cap B \supseteq AB

Let ab \in AB

Now, ab \in A since a \in A, b \in R and A is an ideal of R. Also, ab \in B since b \in B, a \in R and B is an ideal of R. Hence ab \in A \cap B.

∴ A \cap B \supseteq AB

∴ A \cap B = AB

I think that's it... If someone could look over it for me and tell me maybe if I missed something or if it's completely wrong that would be great :).

Writing e=a+b is a great idea. I think you could write it read a little better. Like did you really need to say "Hence ka \in A and kb \in B hence k \in A + B"? Did you ever use that k is in A+B?
 
Dick said:
Writing e=a+b is a great idea. I think you could write it read a little better. Like did you really need to say "Hence ka \in A and kb \in B hence k \in A + B"? Did you ever use that k is in A+B?

Yes good point. I never used it at all so I don't need it there. I wrote it down just to have it around incase I MAY have needed it yknow?

Does anything else not make sense or has early morning thinking saved me again?
 
Zondrina said:
Yes good point. I never used it at all so I don't need it there. I wrote it down just to have it around incase I MAY have needed it yknow?

Does anything else not make sense or has early morning thinking saved me again?

No, it all looks good to me.
 

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