Ugliness & Misery: Seeking the Positive

[Lisa!]

Do you consider ugliness a misery? Do you think is there any nice thing about being ugly?

 

[Andy]

I think miserable people are ugly.

 

[Cyrus]

Do you consider ugliness a misery? Do you think is there any nice thing about being ugly?

I think you are ugly.

 

[Evo]

Beauty (and ugliness) are in the eye of the beholder. I think a lot of men are ugly that other women find attractive and vice versa.

 

[JasonRox]

I hope you guys are talking of someone who isn't just flat out atrocious.

Because if they were, happiness will be hard to achieve in my opinion.

 

[JasonRox]

I really must say, I have never seen such a person. You mean like the hunchback of Notre Dame? This kind of thing is only in fiction.

Are you sure? Have you ever stopped and look?

http://www.uglypeople.nl/?onderwerp=vrouwen

Obviously we only notice attractive people, but take a look around and some should pop out just as often as really attractive ones.

 

[GeoMike]

Do you think is there any nice thing about being ugly?

Well, one upside is that you never have to wonder if your mate is with you just because of your looks.
And if you're ugly and poor then you've got it twice as good!

-GeoMike- (Poor and ugly, but happily married!)

 

[JasonRox]

Well, one upside is that you never have to wonder if your mate is with you just because of your looks.
And if you're ugly and poor then you've got it twice as good!

-GeoMike- (Poor and ugly, but happily married!)

Cheers to that!

 

[Schrodinger's Dog]

Well aside from the obvious ugliness is on the inside whatever is on the outside doesn't matter, the world works on the Halo effect. The great thing is the Halo effect will sometimes turn you into a shallow unpersonable fool. The point is there's nothing more important than what's up top, and little less important than what people see. It's just most people are too absorbed with the outside to see it. Screw 'em they're morons

I made the word unpersonable up BTW.

 

[Jimmy Snyder]

People are rarely as ugly as they look.

 

[octelcogopod]

Well, there is no denying that some people are easier on the eyes than others, some people can have a lot of acne, be fat, or just have a face figure that makes them less attractive.
I think these are things we notice in people because we are always looking to improve ourselves, and we have set a goal of what we think is beautiful and what is not.

Beauty may be in the eye of the beholder, but when given the choice, I don't think anyone would choose to be 400 pounds, face full of acne and an unattractive face figure. (Although I agree what is an attractive face is EXTREMELY subjective.)

I am by the way speaking about the western world, aka europe and america, can't really speak for other cultures as they may have completely different standards.

 

[LURCH]

Do you consider ugliness a misery?

Nope, I'm generally quite content!

 

[Lisa!]

Hope what you're saying would be true all the time. And those whom we consider ugly, would be looked beautiful in someone else's eyes beautiful. Although in some cases that seems pretty impossible!

BTW, does anyone agree that being fairly ugly is a bliss?

 

[Schrodinger's Dog]

Hope what you're saying would be true all the time. And those whom we consider ugly, would be looked beautiful in someone else's eyes beautiful. Although in some cases that seems pretty impossible!

BTW, does anyone agree that being fairly ugly is a bliss?

In a way yes because the Halo effect is not a matter so people take you on what you can do, not what they think you can do based on your outstanding God like physical and erm wow he's cute or strong or good at maths or,or jeez abilities; it means you work harder to garner a result.

If you are blind then your other senses become more of a worth to you and others, if you have nothing but your mind then your mind becomes the sole proprieter of your worth. So yes Beauty doesn't matter, unless your worth is based on it. And how often does that matter? By the way I'm not hideous troll or anything it's just my opinion based on what I see Being ugly or disfigured or anyhitng that makes people prejudge you makes you work harder, so yes it is worthy if it makes you strive beyond your physical "difficulty".

 

[Lisa!]

I think ugliness could be nice since ugly people especially women don't have hard time to choose 1 of the guys around them. As mentioned, they focus on their work and try to prove themselves by their accomplishments since they know they don't have any other way to prove themselves. Oh and most of people have no difficulty telling an ugly person what they really think of him/her. There are less distractions in their lives. so that they can concentrate on getting the best by their talents.
Ugliness could be also a trouble since people are more likely to accept an ugly person's nastiness. I mean it's hard to think a cute person could be nasty. Some people just never believe that some one is nasty if s/he's cute.

 

[Lisa!]

I am surprised Lisa by your thoughts on all this and how people view things differently. I do not think that our looks have a bearing on our luck in life and how happy we are in life.
The beautiful people, on the contrary, seem to me to often have bad luck or perhaps are noticeable when they have bad luck. Although I am not sure what our comments have achieved, I am struck by the directness of your question!

Could you please tell me what you mean by luck?
I don't remember I mentioned luck here. Perhaps you mean the opposite of miserable that's lucky, eh?
Anyway I don't think people are miserable because of having bad luck. There are so many people who get lots of great opportunities(Luck is about oppottunities, IMO) but they just waste all of that by their stupidity!

 

[tribdog]

It is better to be attractive than to be ugly. I'm not saying that attractive people are better people, or that we are happier people, but we do have advantages over ugly people and many things are easier. I think the advantages mostly deal with trivial things like getting quicker service in a crowded bar. Humans treat beauty better than ugly. If you don't think that's true ask yourself if you've ever gone out and fed some birds or squirrels and see if you've done the same thing for the roaches and the slugs as often.

 

[Lisa!]

Agree! But sometimes ugly poeple get quicker service since people can't stand them.
I always think that how ugly people can stand their own appearance! But surprisingly I notice that most of them are quite confident on their looks and even consider themselves quite beautiful while some attractive people are quite opposite!

 

[tribdog]

This is probably unfair, but I think that its okay that I think attractive people have advantages over ugly people, because I don't think bad things about somene who is unattractive.
However, I think that your attitude against ugly people is disgusting. It makes me sick that you can't stand someone because they aren't attractive.
Your comments are offensive and I don't want you to be agreeing with me.
I was simply pointing out attractive people have advantages in social situations, where as you are judging a person's worth. I don't think I've explained myself very well here, but there is a distinction. I would never consider getting rid of a person that i wasn't attracted to, they are still human beings and are worth knowing. If I am attracted to someone though, I will try to impress them and spend more time with them. Do you see the distinction?

 

[Lisa!]

Seems like you don't get what smilies are about. means I'm joking here.
I'm also sick and tired of seeing people put words in my mouth. when did I say I can't stand ugly people and how can you be sure that I'm not ugly myself?
As for myself well I never turn down someone because of his/her look since I think you get used to people's appearances after awhile! But you I can't stand ugly rude people who likes to ruin your day as well as beautiful rude people.(a rude person doesn't seem attractive IMO anyway)
I started this thread because someone was speaking about 1 of my high school friends and how ugly she is. That really made me upset.

PS I just agreed with getting quicker service part of your post!

 

[Lisa!]

Oh and I just felt like diggin up this thread:
1. I was bored to death today!(thanks for your nice words that makde it better )
2. I looked in the morning today and felt bad about my appearance. and that reminded me of this thread!

 

[tribdog]

don't get all butt hurt. If you were kidding about what you said, then my comments don't mean anything because they don't apply to the real you. If my comments do apply to the real you then they are deserved, but still don't mean anything. Who am I to pass judgement? Just because I'm better than you doesn't give me the right to pass judgement on you, yet.

 

[big man]

Nature (or God) ****s on random people. You're just lucky if you go through life without tragedy. Doesn't matter if your name is Fabio or Quasimodo, that's how it is! ;)

 

[Mattara]

I think it was ugly people who invented "looks does not matter".

 

[radou]

I think it was ugly people who invented "looks does not matter".

No, it was intelligent people.

 

[zoobyshoe]

Attractive people have a distinct advantage, because they are freely given attention that others have to fight for. That being the case they generally feel more confident. This stacks the cards in their favor in any interpersonal situation. That doesn't mean they can't blow it by making stupid decisions, or that they can't suffer from bad luck, and it doesn't guarrantee happiness, but it still ends up being an advantage they can make use of if they want, just as being born rich can be.

Ugly people are, in fact, at a disadvantage when in any kind of competition with attractive people; for mates, for jobs, for service. Ugly people almost never naturally assume the kind of confidence people like to see in another person so people steer clear of them. When ugly people do manage to get the kind of easygoing, calm, confidence that everyone likes, they start to tip the odds in their favor, and can even become popular.

It's not the attractiveness per se that matters but the confidence that usually comes with it.

 

[turbo]

Who wants a pretty girl as a mate or co-worker? I would rather look for a woman who is kind, generous, thoughtful, and loyal - that's what I consider an attractive person. If she's pretty, too, that's icing on the cake, but it ain't the cake, boys and girls. I got lucky over 30 years ago, and we've been married ever since - and yes, I thought she was one of the cutest girls I had ever met. I use the terms boys and girls advisedly here, since we were barely out of our teens, and could have ended up making a big mistake as many of our friends and classmates did. Some of the people we went to school with have been divorced two or three times in the last 30 years.

Most of what I consider "attractive" in a person has to do with their character and you can't determine that with a look at the wrapper. A beauty-queen holds no attraction for me if she is vain and self-centered, or if she is manipulative, or will gossip or lie for position in her peer group, or is always on the lookout for a "better deal". Women should demand the same of their men. I agree that in fleeting social or business encounters, the most handsome man and the loveliest woman may get undue attention and advantage, but that advantage doesn't last forever if they can't back it up with the REAL goods.

 

[Astronuc]

Some of the people we went to school with have been divorced two or three times in the last 30 years.

That's been my experience, which really surprises me. My daughter told me a statistic that people in the US are married an average of 3 times! That means for every one of us whose been married once, there has to be someone married 5 times.

Most of what I consider "attractive" in a person has to do with their character

That's pretty much my philosophy.

Beauty is fine, but it's not as important as what's inside. In my experience, those who early get the message that they are beautiful and that beauty is of prime importance develop a rather superficial personality.

I wouldn't shy away from a beautiful woman, but there would have to be a thoughtful and intelligent mind inside. One of the woman I dated was very attractive (to me at least), and she have a nice personality, but when she didn't know anything about Albert Einstein or the Theory of Relativity, I knew that relationship wasn't going beyond friendship.

the most handsome man and the loveliest woman

Unfortunately, the media over-emphasize the so-called beautiful people, most of whom seem to have significant personality disorders or are otherwise dysfunctional, and their relationships seem dysfunctional.

Attractive people have a distinct advantage,

Maybe in some circles, but definitely not where I work, nor in the field in which I work. In what I do, smarts and problem solving ability are the principal requirements, as it should be.

 

[zoobyshoe]

I would rather look for a woman who is kind, generous, thoughtful, and loyal...

I think you're missing the point. Given two women who are both equally kind, generous, thoughtful, and loyal, the more attractive one wins.

 

[Astronuc]

it is just as hard to find a perfect gentleman.

And I've noticed that it hasn't gotten any easier, and perhaps it's less likely these days.

 

[tribdog]

That's been my experience, which really surprises me. My daughter told me a statistic that people in the US are married an average of 3 times! That means for every one of us whose been married once, there has to be someone married 5 times.

I would question that statistic. It might seem true, but at least in my case I know a lot more people with only 1 or zero marriages than people with 5 or 6.

Maybe in some circles, but definitely not where I work, nor in the field in which I work. In what I do, smarts and problem solving ability are the principal requirements, as it should be.

So you are saying that when some hot young girl starts working and is having a problem you don't see guys offering to help out a little bit quicker, or being a little more patient and forgiving of her mistakes. Come on, it's human nature. I'm sure that smarts and ability are the principal requirements, in almost any field, but no matter what field you are in there are going to be interactions where you think with your pants instead of your head.

Scene #1: Pretty girl with hammer
P.G.:"Whoops! Did i hit your finger? I'm sorry"
Astronuc: "That's okay. I shouldn't have been holding the nail like I was. Let me readjust my grip. There we go. Try again. Just be careful please, I need these fingers to comb my beard. <chuckle>

Scene #2: Ugly guy with hammer
U.G.:"Whoops!"
Astronuc:<sticks head in from other room>"What'd you break? Aren't you done with that hammer yet? Hurry up."

 

[zoobyshoe]

Well just as it is difficult to find a perfectly beautiful woman that also happens to be intelligent, it is just as hard to find a consummate gentleman.

I think it's vastly easier to find a beautiful, intelligent woman than a consummate gentleman. I'm not sure I have ever personally met a guy who fit that description. I may have met several garden variety gentlmen, but no consummate ones.

Jack Nicholson, the actor, claims that his success with women is entirely due to his observing all the proper "gentlemanly" things. This both surprises and charms them.

 

[Astronuc]

So you are saying that when some hot young girl starts working and is having a problem you don't see guys offering to help out a little bit quicker, or being a little more patient and forgiving of her mistakes. Come on, it's human nature. I'm sure that smarts and ability are the principal requirements, in almost any field, but no matter what field you are in there are going to be interactions where you think with your pants instead of your head.

Absolutely not. Whether or not a peron is attractive or not, they get treated the same in the organization where I work. We care about results and the ability of someone to solve difficult problems. Goods looks are useless for what we do.

Scene #1: Pretty girl with hammer
P.G.:"Whoops! Did i hit your finger? I'm sorry"
Astronuc: "That's okay. I shouldn't have been holding the nail like I was. Let me readjust my grip. There we go. Try again. Just be careful please, I need these fingers to comb my beard. <chuckle>

Scene #2: Ugly guy with hammer
U.G.:"Whoops!"
Astronuc:<sticks head in from other room>"What'd you break? Aren't you done with that hammer yet? Hurry up."

Nope, I'd treat people much the same, regardless of attractiveness.

When I taught students, looks had no influence on the way I interacted with students. I simply cared about their ability to learn and do the work, their assignments and tests.

 

[zoobyshoe]

Absolutely not. Whether or not a peron is attractive or not, they get treated the same in the organization where I work. We care about results and the ability of someone to solve difficult problems. Goods looks are useless for what we do.

Good looks are useless for the job at hand in just about everything outside of modeling. Still, I'd rather work with the hot babe any day, even if she's less competent than the others.

Nope, I'd treat people much the same, regardless of attractiveness.

Me too, when I think anyone's looking.

When I taught students, looks had no influence on the way I interacted with students. I simply cared about their ability to learn and do the work, their assignments and tests.

Given the choice of being homework helper to a hot babe or a bright guy, I'll take the babe.

 

[JasonRox]

Given the choice of being homework helper to a hot babe or a bright guy, I'll take the babe.

I'd pick the girl only if she's cool. I'm not a fan of talking to hollow rocks.

There are plenty of good looking girls out there, so I won't waste my time with one that is stupid.

 

[Cyrus]

I'd pick the girl only if she's cool. I'm not a fan of talking to hollow rocks.

There are plenty of good looking girls out there, so I won't waste my time with one that is stupid.

Amen brother.

 

[Astronuc]

http://today.reuters.com/news/articlenews.aspx?type=scienceNews&storyID=2006-09-27T233029Z_01_N27417408_RTRUKOC_0_US-LOOKS.xml&WTmodLoc=NewsArt-L3-Science+NewsNews-4

TORONTO (Reuters) - When someone is "easy on the eye," it could also be because they are easy on the brain, according to a new international study.

Scientists from universities in the United States and New Zealand analyzed previous studies and conducted new research to find that attractiveness could be linked to ease of mental processing.

The study, published in the journal Psychological Science, looked at previous research that found people rated images of standard-looking objects or people as more attractive than variations of these things.

They also tested people by showing them a prototype image made up of dots and geometric patterns and variations of it to see which people liked the most.

Piotr Winkielman of the University of California, San Diego, who led the research, said the less time it took to classify a pattern, the more attractive it was judged.

"We show that this preference for the prototype is a function of the prototype being particularly easy to perceive," Winkielman told Reuters on Tuesday. "So the easier the better."

People get paid to study beauty?

And the article goes on to talk about chili.

 

[Artman]

This thread reminds me of that line by some comedian (sorry I can't think of who it was), that goes something like this:

He would say, "One out of every three people is ugly. So look at the person on your right, and on your left, and if they look okay to you..."

The thing with how a person looks is that it can have an effect on the way they percieve themselves, effect their confidence and their self esteem.

 

[Artman]

Know what the difference is between an gorgeous woman and an ugly woman?

A gorgeous woman beats men off with a stick.

An ugly woman uses her hands.

 

[zoobyshoe]

http://today.reuters.com/news/articlenews.aspx?type=scienceNews&storyID=2006-09-27T233029Z_01_N27417408_RTRUKOC_0_US-LOOKS.xml&WTmodLoc=NewsArt-L3-Science+NewsNews-4

TORONTO (Reuters) - When someone is "easy on the eye," it could also be because they are easy on the brain, according to a new international study.

Scientists from universities in the United States and New Zealand analyzed previous studies and conducted new research to find that attractiveness could be linked to ease of mental processing.

The study, published in the journal Psychological Science, looked at previous research that found people rated images of standard-looking objects or people as more attractive than variations of these things.

They also tested people by showing them a prototype image made up of dots and geometric patterns and variations of it to see which people liked the most.

Piotr Winkielman of the University of California, San Diego, who led the research, said the less time it took to classify a pattern, the more attractive it was judged.

"We show that this preference for the prototype is a function of the prototype being particularly easy to perceive," Winkielman told Reuters on Tuesday. "So the easier the better."

People get paid to study beauty?

And the article goes on to talk about chili.

This is Mies van der Rohe's Less Is More.

People study what appeals to people all the time, primarily for sales purposes. They want to design and make products that people want to buy. A city planner, for instance, might take the results of this study and realize that visually simpler signs will be more appealing and make the city more tourist friendly. It's not useless information.

 

[ViewsofMars]

There are no ugly people. There is beauty in everyone.

 

[ViewsofMars]

. . continuing on with my last post. Except for serial killers!

 

[imiyakawa]

Well aside from the obvious ugliness is on the inside whatever is on the outside doesn't matter.

Well for adherents to the physicalist perspective I don't see why an ugly inside is no more subjective/intheeyeofthebeholder than an ugly outside, both are constructions of the brain.

 

[DanP]

I think physical attractiveness is in the eye of the majority, not in the the of the beholder.
It's certainly useful to be a good looking person. In all avenues of life.

 

[Kajahtava]

One nice thing about ugliness is affirmative action. A really ugly girl once said she wanted to 'play with me' (yeah, long time back), I almost said yes, until I realized I only said yes because she was ugly, because I always said no to that quaestion; thus I said no.

But it's with respect to some observer, not in the absolute.

Edit, I would probably be less so inclined to say yes if I had the feeling she was considered handsome by most standards, that feeling I hadn't.

 

[TheStatutoryApe]

One nice thing about ugliness is affirmative action. A really ugly girl once said she wanted to 'play with me' (yeah, long time back), I almost said yes, until I realized I only said yes because she was ugly, because I always said no to that quaestion; thus I said no.

But it's with respect to some observer, not in the absolute.

Edit, I would probably be less so inclined to say yes if I had the feeling she was considered handsome by most standards, that feeling I hadn't.

Yes. "I find you somewhat repulsive but you seem nice and it sort of makes me feel guilty to think that so maybe I will be nicer to you than I would be otherwise so I do not feel as guilty."
I do the same with elderly people and mentally handicapped people. Normally I feel no qualms blowing someone off. Being disturbed by people I have no desire to talk to trying to have a conversation with me really annoys me.

 

[Kajahtava]

Yes. "I find you somewhat repulsive but you seem nice and it sort of makes me feel guilty to think that so maybe I will be nicer to you than I would be otherwise so I do not feel as guilty."
I do the same with elderly people and mentally handicapped people. Normally I feel no qualms blowing someone off. Being disturbed by people I have no desire to talk to trying to have a conversation with me really annoys me.

Hmm, since you obviously only went to this thread because you saw my name and have been following me around for some time, http://blog.nihilarchitect.net/archives/250/on-altruism-reversed/ might be a read for you, especially the part on the frogs.