Wheel acceleration in relation to vertical LOAD and current speed

Click For Summary

Discussion Overview

The discussion revolves around the calculation of wheel acceleration in a car simulation, particularly focusing on how vertical load affects the acceleration and velocity of the wheel. Participants explore the relationship between applied torque, moment of inertia, and the impact of load on the wheel, addressing both theoretical and practical aspects of vehicle dynamics.

Discussion Character

  • Exploratory
  • Technical explanation
  • Mathematical reasoning

Main Points Raised

  • One participant notes that the vertical load on the wheel is significant for developing frictional force between the road and the wheel, which propels the car forward.
  • Another participant seeks a formula to calculate the effect of wheel load on torque, questioning how load influences torque, moment of inertia, and acceleration.
  • A later reply emphasizes that vertical load does not reduce torque or slow the vehicle but rather affects the friction necessary to prevent skidding.
  • Participants discuss the relationship between engine power, torque, and vehicle acceleration, noting that acceleration may appear consistent across gears if the engine operates at constant power.
  • One participant simplifies the acceleration formula to account for mass, moment of inertia, and torque, suggesting that for normal vehicles, the moment of inertia is often negligible.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants generally agree on the role of vertical load in developing friction but express differing views on its impact on torque and acceleration calculations. The discussion remains unresolved regarding the exact mathematical relationship and how to incorporate load into the simulation accurately.

Contextual Notes

Limitations include potential oversights regarding rolling resistance and the specific conditions under which the simplified formulas apply. The discussion does not resolve how to accurately model the effects of weight distribution and load on wheel dynamics.

raze29
Messages
2
Reaction score
0
Hello everybody!

I'm trying to write a car simulation but I'm having problems with precisely calculating the acceleration / velocity of the car's wheel. Currently the simulation works as if the Car was lifted in the air, so there is no load (vertical force) on the Wheel. What I have so far:
- the applied torque (engine torque multiplied with appropriate values)
- mass moment of inertia of the wheel

Now I would like to take into account the weight Load on the Wheel. How do I do this?
Currently the wheel spins up pretty fast even in 5th gear (well not at low RPM, but once the engine and axle are rotating together), but in reality I know it should be accelerating slower at high speeds - but it accelerates at the same speed as in 1st gear. I assume this is normal for no load on the wheel (though I might be wrong!).

Any help would be appreciated! :)

Also this is my first post and this is not a homework assignment.
 
Physics news on Phys.org
The only significance of the vertical load on the wheel is that it permits a frictional force to develop between road and wheel. This applies a torque to the wheel, leading to a forward force on the wheel axle. This is what propels the car. If the frictional force is sufficient, the torque from the road balances the torque from the engine sufficiently that the wheel rolls instead of skidding.
Your observation re accn versus gear is correct. If the engine is working at constant power then the kinetic energy will increase at a constant rate, regardless of the gearing. A low gear just means the engine spins faster. In practice, engines work best within certain ranges of spin, hence the need for gears.
 
Thank you, it was really helpful for understanding how things work!

However I would really like to know the exact formula to calculate the torque loss (?) due to wheel load, but can't find anywhere on the internet. So if we have:

- torque applied to the wheel axle
- moment of inertia of the wheel
- mass or vertical force of load on wheel
- road friction maybe

how do I change the formula which I currently have:

velocity = velocity + (torque / inertia)

Does the load somehow reduce the torque? Change the moment of inertia? Reduce acceleration? If so, how? (just to be accurate with the weight + weight distribution of the car, I don't really want random numbers)

Edit: velocity is in rad/s, torque is in N-m
 
Last edited:
You say I've helped, but from your latest questions I'm not sure. You're still fixated on vertical load, though I already pointed out this is mostly of interest in ensuring there's no skidding. It does not act to reduce torque or slow the vehicle. What matters is inertia.

Let the mass of the vehicle (including wheels) be M, the moment of inertia of the wheels (all 4 combined) be I, torque (total for driving wheels) T, wheel radius R.
The linear acceleration A of vehicle = TR/(MR2+I)
For normal road cars, I is fairly insignificant, simplifying it to A = T/(MR). I guess I matters for dragsters.
I'm assuming road friction is adequate to prevent skidding, and I've ignored rolling resistance. Rolling resistance deducts a constant amount from the acceleration, so long as the velocity is nonzero.
 

Similar threads

Replies
9
Views
2K
  • · Replies 15 ·
Replies
15
Views
5K
  • · Replies 95 ·
4
Replies
95
Views
7K
  • · Replies 8 ·
Replies
8
Views
7K
  • · Replies 17 ·
Replies
17
Views
1K
  • · Replies 18 ·
Replies
18
Views
8K
  • · Replies 8 ·
Replies
8
Views
3K
  • · Replies 3 ·
Replies
3
Views
4K
  • · Replies 22 ·
Replies
22
Views
5K
  • · Replies 4 ·
Replies
4
Views
4K