Calculating Work Done by Expanding Gas in Spherical Bubble

Click For Summary

Homework Help Overview

The problem involves calculating the work done by a gas inside a spherical bubble as it expands from a radius R to 2R, considering atmospheric pressure and surface tension. Participants are exploring the implications of surface tension and pressure on the work done during this expansion.

Discussion Character

  • Exploratory, Assumption checking, Conceptual clarification

Approaches and Questions Raised

  • Participants discuss the relationship between surface tension and the area of the bubble, questioning the algebra used in calculating the change in area. There are also considerations of whether the expansion is isothermal or irreversible, and how this affects the work done.

Discussion Status

The discussion is active, with participants providing insights into the calculations and questioning the assumptions made about the nature of the gas expansion. Some guidance has been offered regarding the correct expressions for work done, but no consensus has been reached on the final answer.

Contextual Notes

There is a noted ambiguity regarding whether the bubble is in a liquid or gas, which affects the calculations for work done. Participants are also grappling with the implications of pressure changes during the expansion process.

AdityaDev
Messages
527
Reaction score
33

Homework Statement


(1)The gas inside a spherical bubble expands slowly so that its radius is increases from R to 2R. Atmospheric pressure is ##P_0## and surface tension is S. The work done by the gas is ___________

Homework Equations


work done against surface tension ##W_t = S.\Delta A## where A is the surface area and S is the surface tension.

The Attempt at a Solution


initial area =##(4\pi R^2)##
final area = ## (4\pi(4R^2-R^2))##
so W against S is ##S.8\pi R^2##
but the answer given is ##\frac{25\pi P_0R^3}{3} + 24\pi S R^2##
where did the first term containing ##P_0## come from and why is the second term ##24\pi SR^2##
 
Physics news on Phys.org
Regarding the second term, your algebra is incorrect, your equation for the final area is incorrect (your second equation gives for the change in area), and the surface tension acts at both surfaces of the bubble (so you're missing a factor of 2). With regard to the first term, you omitted the PdV work to push back the atmosphere.

Chet
 
Chestermiller said:
With regard to the first term, you omitted the PdV work to push back the atmosphere.
##P_{int}## is not a constant right?(as V becomes V+dV, P becomes P-dP)
so if I consider the process to be isothermal, I will get
##W_2=nRTlog(\frac{V_f}{V_i})##.
but there is no log term in the answer.[/QUOTE]
 
AdityaDev said:
##P_{int}## is not a constant right?(as V becomes V+dV, P becomes P-dP)
so if I consider the process to be isothermal, I will get
##W_2=nRTlog(\frac{V_f}{V_i})##.
but there is no log term in the answer.
No this is not the correct equation to use. If assumes that the gas expansion occurs isothermally and reversibly. If the initial pressure inside the bubble is high enough to cause the bubble to spontaneously expand to the final equilibrium volume, then the expansion is irreversible. If the gas is at equilibrium initially, then to increase its volume you need to increase the temperature or the number of moles. In all these cases, the work done by the gas is P0ΔV + 2SΔA.

Chet
 
Chestermiller said:
No this is not the correct equation to use. If assumes that the gas expansion occurs isothermally and reversibly. If the initial pressure inside the bubble is high enough to cause the bubble to spontaneously expand to the final equilibrium volume, then the expansion is irreversible. If the gas is at equilibrium initially, then to increase its volume you need to increase the temperature or the number of moles. In all these cases, the work done by the gas is P0ΔV + 2SΔA.

Chet

understood. if an air bubble expands in a liquid then the expression will be ##P_0\Delta V + S\Delta A## right?
 
AdityaDev said:
understood. if an air bubble expands in a liquid then the expression will be ##P_0\Delta V + S\Delta A## right?
Not exactly. The problem statement and answer book solution implies that the bubble is not in a liquid. It is a bubble in a gas (think balloon). The gas pressure on the inside surface of the bubble is given by:
$$P=\frac{4S}{r}+P_0$$
The volume of the bubble is:
$$V=\frac{4}{3}\pi r^3$$
So that:
$$dV=4\pi r^2dr$$
So, the differential work is given by:
$$PdV=(16\pi S r+4\pi r^2)dr$$
(I guess the 25 in the answer book solution should really be a 28.)

So the work is ##P_0\Delta V + 2S\Delta A##

The factor of 2 in front of the S is because a bubble in a gas has an inside surface and an outside surface.

Chet
 
  • Like
Likes   Reactions: AdityaDev
I
Chestermiller said:
Not exactly. The problem statement and answer book solution implies that the bubble is not in a liquid. It is a bubble in a gas (think balloon). The gas pressure on the inside surface of the bubble is given by:
$$P=\frac{4S}{r}+P_0$$
The volume of the bubble is:
$$V=\frac{4}{3}\pi r^3$$
So that:
$$dV=4\pi r^2dr$$
So, the differential work is given by:
$$PdV=(16\pi S r+4\pi r^2)dr$$
(I guess the 25 in the answer book solution should really be a 28.)

So the work is ##P_0\Delta V + 2S\Delta A##

The factor of 2 in front of the S is because a bubble in a gas has an inside surface and an outside surface.

Chet
Thank you sir. The answer given must be wrong.
 

Similar threads

  • · Replies 22 ·
Replies
22
Views
1K
Replies
2
Views
2K
  • · Replies 10 ·
Replies
10
Views
3K
  • · Replies 63 ·
3
Replies
63
Views
5K
Replies
18
Views
5K
  • · Replies 21 ·
Replies
21
Views
2K
  • · Replies 1 ·
Replies
1
Views
3K
  • · Replies 3 ·
Replies
3
Views
3K
  • · Replies 6 ·
Replies
6
Views
3K
  • · Replies 3 ·
Replies
3
Views
3K