Conceptual question on heat transfer (Steady-state)

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Discussion Overview

The discussion revolves around the concept of heat transfer in a one-dimensional planar slab, specifically addressing the conditions under which the system can be considered to be in a steady state. Participants explore the relationship between convection and conduction heat fluxes and seek clarification on the underlying principles, including the use of electrical analogies to understand these concepts.

Discussion Character

  • Conceptual clarification
  • Technical explanation
  • Exploratory

Main Points Raised

  • One participant questions how to determine if the heat transfer problem is in a steady state, given the temperatures at different points and the external conditions.
  • Another participant points out a mismatch in variable labeling within the equations presented.
  • A clarification is made regarding the correct labeling of temperatures in the equations.
  • One participant proposes an electrical analogy where convection and thermal conductivity constants are likened to electrical conductivities, suggesting that heat transfer can be modeled similarly to electric current flow.
  • It is noted that at steady state, the heat flow must be consistent throughout the system to avoid temperature discrepancies, akin to current flow in an electrical circuit.
  • Participants discuss whether heat flux can be equated to electric flux, with one suggesting that temperature can be modeled as voltage and heat flow as current.
  • Another participant mentions the possibility of using different models for physical systems, emphasizing the importance of consistency in the underlying constants.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants generally agree on the use of electrical analogies to understand heat transfer, but there is no consensus on the specifics of how heat flux relates to electric flux, as different modeling approaches are acknowledged.

Contextual Notes

Some participants highlight the need to consider the cross-sectional area in the application of thermal conductivity and convection constants, and the role of thermal mass in steady state conditions is mentioned but not fully explored.

batmankiller
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So this isn't a homework problem persay, it was given information but I just couldn't wrap my head on why this was true.

We have 1-d heat transfer through a planar slab. If we have a T_a for the temperature outside, then as we T_1 for the temperature on one end of the surface, and T_2 for the temperature on the other end, and T_b as the temperature outside the building on the other, how can we tell that this is a steady state problem?
temp.png


h is the material thermal convection constant and k is the material thermal conductivity
We eventually set the convection flux equal to the conduction flux:

J_conduction = J_convection =
h(T_h - T_1) = (K/L)(T_1 -T_3)

Why is he able to set the fluxes equal to each other? Why wouldn't the convection flux be different from the conduction flux? Perhaps this would be more clear if someone could use an analogy approach of electrical circuits?
 
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The variables in your equation don't seem to match the labels in your diagram.
 
Yes sorry T_3 is T_2. and T_h is T_A.
 
If you want an electrical analogy, the convection and thermal conductivity constants become electrical conductivities. As such they will support potential differences when current flows through them. Stated another way, a potential difference across them causes a current to flow through them. Thus heat transfer is modeled as an electric current.

To model your diagram as an electric circuit, the temperatures become voltages, the heat flow becomes current. The convection constant applies at the interfaces and the conductivity applies to the bulk slab. Assuming Ta > Tb, heat will flow from Ta towards Tb. It flows sequentially from the medium at Ta to the slab via the left interface, through the body of the slab to the right interface and hence to the medium at Tb. As such it is modeled as a series circuit:

attachment.php?attachmentid=44552&stc=1&d=1330569736.gif


It should be noted that the constants h and k should really be multiplied by the cross sectional area, as they represent conductivity per unit area. Not represented in the diagram is the thermal mass of the slab (which would be represented as a capacitance). At steady state (after a long time at constant conditions) such a capacitance reaches a final "charge" and ceases to affect circuit operation, so the diagram represents steady state conditions.

At steady state the current must be the same all along its path, otherwise electrons (or heat) would be piling up in some places or running deficits in others -- creating spontaneous charge buildups or deficits (hot or cold spots) contrary to the laws of thermodynamics.
 

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Ah that makes a lot of sense. Quick question though, is the heat flux equivalent to the J in electric flux as well?
 
batmankiller said:
Ah that makes a lot of sense. Quick question though, is the heat flux equivalent to the J in electric flux as well?

There are several different ways to model various physical system electrically, equating different quantities to either voltage or current. In this case temperature is modeled as voltage and heat flow (Watts) is modeled as current J. But it would be possible to use current density, such as in a conductor of a given size, or current flux. One has to ponder the underlying makeup of the various constants between physical systems to keep things consistent :smile:
 

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