Non-dimensionalization - Given heat balance EQ, convert to a dimensionless EQ

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Homework Help Overview

The discussion revolves around the non-dimensionalization of a heat balance equation, specifically transforming it into a dimensionless form using a defined radial coordinate and temperature difference. The original equation involves derivatives with respect to the radial coordinate and aims to demonstrate a specific mathematical structure.

Discussion Character

  • Exploratory, Mathematical reasoning, Assumption checking

Approaches and Questions Raised

  • Participants explore the implications of introducing a dimensionless radial coordinate and the substitution of variables. Questions arise regarding the treatment of constants and the differentiation process, particularly concerning potential division by zero and the cancellation of terms.

Discussion Status

The conversation reflects a dynamic exchange of ideas, with participants attempting to clarify the mathematical manipulations involved. Some guidance has been provided regarding the cancellation of constants and the form of the equation, but there remains a lack of consensus on the implications of these manipulations.

Contextual Notes

Participants are navigating the constraints of the problem, including the requirement to show a specific form of the equation and the definitions of the variables involved. The nature of the constants and their role in the equations is a point of contention.

VinnyCee
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Homework Statement



Define a dimensionless radial coordinate as

x\,=\,r\,\sqrt{\frac{2\,h}{b\,k}}

and introduce y\,=\,T\,-\,T_a, and thus show the elementary equation

x^2\,\frac{d^2y}{dx}\,+\,x\,\frac{dy}{dx}\,-\,x^2\,y\,=\,0

describes the physical situation.

It gives the "physical situation" equation in the previous problem:

\frac{1}{r}\,\frac{d}{dr}\,\left(r\,\frac{dT}{dr}\right)\,-\,\left(\frac{2\,h}{b\,k}\right)\,\left(T\,-\,T_a\right)\,=\,0

Homework Equations



http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nondimensionalization"

The Attempt at a Solution



Re-expressing the constants

z\,=\,\frac{2\,h}{b\,k}

solving the dimensionless radial coordinate for r

r\,=\,\frac{x}{\sqrt{z}}

Now, I substitute these along with y\,=\,T\,-\,T_a[/tex] into the &quot;physical situation&quot; equation that I am supposed to non-dimensionalize<br /> <br /> \frac{\sqrt{z}}{x}\,\frac{d}{d\left(\frac{x}{\sqrt{z}}\right)}\,\left[\left(\frac{x}{\sqrt{z}}\right)\,\frac{dT}{d\left(\frac{x}{\sqrt{z}}\right)}\right]\,-\,z\,y\,=\,0<br /> <br /> What do I do about the denominator in the second and fourth fractions?<br /> <br /> \frac{d}{d\left(\frac{x}{\sqrt{z}}\right)}
 
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It looks like sqrt(z) is just a constant. So d(x/sqrt(z))=dx/sqrt(z). z should cancel out of the equation altogether.
 
Yes, \sqrt{z} is only a constant.

So you are saying that

\frac{d}{d\left(\frac{x}{\sqrt{z}}\right)}\,=\,\frac{d}{\frac{dx}{\sqrt{z}}}

Right? So, does that mean that

\frac{d}{\frac{dx}{\sqrt{z}}}\,=\,\frac{d\sqrt{z}}{dx}\,=\,\frac{d}{dx}\sqrt{z}\,=\,0

since \sqrt{z} is constant?
 
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Riggghhhhtttt.
 
But when I apply that to the equation above

\frac{\sqrt{z}}{x}\,\frac{d}{d\left(\frac{x}{\sqrt{z}}\right)}\,\left[\left(\frac{x}{\sqrt{z}}\right)\,\frac{dT}{d\left(\frac{x}{\sqrt{z}}\right)}\right]\,-\,z\,y\,=\,0

There is division by zero and it just zeros out the whole equation. I am supposed to show that it is of the form

x^2\,\frac{d^2y}{dx}\,+\,x\,\frac{dy}{dx}\,-\,x^2\,y\,=\,0
 
Division by zero? z is nonzero. It cancels inside the brackets and gives a common factor of z for the two terms.
 
\frac{\sqrt{z}}{x}\,\frac{d}{d\left(\frac{x}{\sqrt{z}}\right)}\,\left[\left(\frac{x}{\sqrt{z}}\right)\,\frac{dT}{d\left(\frac{x}{\sqrt{z}}\right)}\right]\,-\,z\,y\,=\,0

The \frac{\sqrt{z}}{x} terms cancel each other out to one

\frac{d}{d\left(\frac{x}{\sqrt{z}}\right)}\,\frac{dT}{d\left(\frac{x}{\sqrt{z}}\right)}\,-\,z\,y\,=\,0

Now what? Multiply it all by d\left(\frac{x}{\sqrt{z}}\right)?

If I do that, I get

d\left(dT\right)\,-\,\frac{d}{d\left(\frac{x}{\sqrt{z}}\right)}\,z\,y\,=\,0

Then what?
 
Dick said:
Division by zero? z is nonzero. It cancels inside the brackets and gives a common factor of z for the two terms.

It (sqrt(z)) cancels inside the brackets and gives a common factor of z for the two terms on the left hand side of the equation. Which can be factored out. 0/z=0. That is not division by zero. Don't make me repeat this again.
 
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You are saying that z "cancels inside the brackets". Can you show how you arrive at that conclusion, because I don't see how z cancels.
 
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  • #10
Ok. (x/sqrt(z))*dT/d(x/sqrt(z))=(x/sqrt(z))*sqrt(z)*(dT/dx)=x*(dT/dx). 1/sqrt(z) is in the denominator of the differential. Move it into the numerator as sqrt(z) and then cancel with the sqrt(z) in the denominator of the first factor. Differentials are a lot like fractions if that is what is bothering you.
 
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  • #11
OIC, from the equality in the third post

\frac{d}{d\left(\frac{x}{\sqrt{z}}\right)}\,=\,\frac{d}{\frac{dx}{\sqrt{z}}}\,=\,\sqrt{z}\,\frac{d}{dx}

If I apply that to the steady-state heat balance equation as you have shown, I get

\frac{\sqrt{z}}{x}\,\sqrt{z}\,\frac{d}{dx}\left(x\,\frac{dT}{dx}\right)\,-\,z\,y\,=\,0

\frac{z}{x}\,\frac{d}{dx}\left(x\,\frac{dT}{dx}\right)\,-\,z\,y\,=\,0

\frac{z}{x}\left(\frac{dT}{dx}\,+\,x\,\frac{d^2T}{dx^2}\right)\,-\,z\,y\,=\,0

z\,\frac{d^2T}{dx^2}\,+\,\frac{z}{x}\,\frac{dT}{dx}\,-\,z\,y\,=\,0

Which is the form I am looking to show if I consider z\,=\,x^2.

x^2\,\frac{d^2y}{dx}\,+\,x\,\frac{dy}{dx}\,-\,x^2\,y\,=\,0

So, the x^2 term in the general equation is equivalent to z in the heat balance equation. Does this conclude the problem?

Thank you for the help:smile:
 
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  • #12
You cannot consider x^2=z. z is constant, x is not. Cancel z from this:

z\,\frac{d^2T}{dx^2}\,+\,\frac{z}{x}\,\frac{dT}{dx }\,-\,z\,y\,=\,0

and multiply the result by x^2.
 
  • #13
So, I divide both sides of

z\,\frac{d^2T}{dx^2}\,+\,\frac{z}{x}\,\frac{dT}{dx}\,-\,z\,y\,=\,0

by z to get

\frac{d^2T}{dx^2}\,+\,\frac{1}{x}\,\frac{dT}{dx}\,-\,y\,=\,0

and then multiply everything by x^2 to get

x^2\,\frac{d^2T}{dx^2}\,+\,x\,\frac{dT}{dx }\,-\,x^2\,y\,=\,0

Why do I multiply by x^2 though?
 
  • #14
VinnyCee said:
So, I divide both sides of

z\,\frac{d^2T}{dx^2}\,+\,\frac{z}{x}\,\frac{dT}{dx}\,-\,z\,y\,=\,0

by z to get

\frac{d^2T}{dx^2}\,+\,\frac{1}{x}\,\frac{dT}{dx}\,-\,y\,=\,0

and then multiply everything by x^2 to get

x^2\,\frac{d^2T}{dx^2}\,+\,x\,\frac{dT}{dx }\,-\,x^2\,y\,=\,0

Why do I multiply by x^2 though?

Just because that was the form you said you wanted to show in the problem statement.
 

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