Lagrangian Definition and 1000 Threads

  1. N

    What is the full Lagrangian of SU(3)xSU(2)xU(1) model?

    What is the full Lagrangian of Standard Model?How can we build a Lagrangian that satisfies both the symmetry SU(3) and the symmetry SU(2) at the same time?
  2. N

    Replacing Lagrangian L with function f(L) for free particle

    Homework Statement [/B] If L is Lagrangian for a (system of) free particle(s) and dL/dt=0, show that any twice differentiable function f(L) gives the same equations of motions. Homework Equations [/B] Euler-Lagrange equations.The Attempt at a Solution Well, after some calculation, I get...
  3. A

    Time ordering operator, interaction Lagrangian, QED

    Homework Statement I am trying to calculate the following quantity: $$<0|T\{\phi^\dagger(x_1) \phi(x_2) exp[i\int{L_1(x)dx}]\}|0>$$ where: $$ L_1(x) = -ieA_{\mu}[\phi^* (\partial_\mu \phi ) - (\partial_\mu \phi^*)\phi] $$[/B] I am trying to find an expression including the propagators...
  4. MaxwellsHammer

    Question on the Inherent Instability of Lagrangian points

    The question revokes around my personal hypothesis that there is two forces connected with the Gravitational Field one obviously attraction between two bodies that is linear and the second is a less powerful repulsive force that emanates in a spiral motion off of rotating bodies that causes the...
  5. A

    Does the Lagrangian of a mattress in QFT make sense?

    Just started with QFT from Zee and am already confused by first equation lol. See attached picture. Does anyone actually understand this? He calls q_a the vertical displacement of particle 'a', and yet he only allows the springs to be horizontally between the particles. So, there should be...
  6. E

    Euler-Lagrange equation (EOM) solutions - hairy lagrangian

    I'm going through Zwiebach Chapter 6 on relativistic strings to try to solve a similar problem. I got all the way to my equation of motion \begin{eqnarray*} \delta S & = & [ p' \delta \theta]_{z 0}^{z 1} + \int_{z 0}^{z 1} d z \left( p - \frac{\partial ( p')}{\partial z} \right) \delta...
  7. C

    Lagrangian is invariant under the transformation

    I should mention that I'm self-studying this material, not taking it as part of a course, but since this is still a homework-style problem I figured it'd be best to post here. Homework Statement In Peskin and Schroeder problem #11.2, they ask us to consider the Lagrangian: $$\mathcal{L} =...
  8. P

    Maxwell Lagrangian at weak fields

    In http://arxiv.org/abs/hep-th/9506035 the author said after writing this equation: $$\frac{1}{4}\eta^{\mu\nu\lambda\rho} F_{\mu\nu}F_{\lambda\rho} = \eta_{\sigma\tau\alpha\beta}\frac{\partial L}{\partial F_{\sigma\tau}} \frac{\partial L}{\partial F_{\alpha\beta} } + 2C$$ where C was arbitrary...
  9. Glomerular

    Lagrangian - rigid body problem

    Homework Statement In a uniform gravitational field, there is a uniform solid disk of of mass M and radius R. A point mass m is glued to the disk at a point that is at a distance a from the center of the disk. The disk rolls without slipping. Find the frequency of small oscillations about the...
  10. P

    Three level Feynman diagramas lagrangian density

    Hi, I am trying to figure out how to draw all the three level Feynman diagrams corresponding to this lagrangian density L = \frac{1}{2} \partial _{\mu} \phi \partial^{\mu} \phi - \frac{\mu^2}{2}\phi^2- \frac{\eta}{3!}\phi^3-\frac{\lambda}{4!} \phi^4+i \bar{\psi} \gamma _{\mu} \partial^{\mu}...
  11. &

    A question on Lagrangian dynamics

    Hi all, I've recently been asked for an explanation as to why the Lagrangian is a function of the positions and velocities of the particles constituting a physical system. What follows is my attempt to answer this question. I would be grateful if you could offer your thoughts on whether this is...
  12. S

    Lagrangian mechanics: sphere inside a cylinder

    The problem goes by this: A sphere of radius ##\rho## is constrained to roll without slipping on the lower half of the inner surface of a hollow cylinder of inside radius R. Determine the Lagrangian function, the equation of constraint, and Lagrange's equations of motion. Find the frequency of...
  13. D

    Derivative of first term in Lagrangian density for real K-G theory

    Hey guys, This is really confusing me cos its allowing me to create factors of 2 from nowhere! Basically, the first term in the Lagrangian for a real Klein-Gordon theory is \frac{1}{2}(\partial_{\mu}\phi)(\partial^{\mu}\phi). Now let's say I wana differentiate this by applying the...
  14. D

    Showing that the real Klein-gordon lagrangian is Lorentz invariant

    Homework Statement Hey guys! So this question should be simple apparently but I got no idea how to do it. Basically I have the following Lagrangian density \mathcal{L}=\frac{1}{2}(\partial_{\mu}\phi)(\partial^{\mu}\phi)-\frac{m}{2}\phi^{2} which should be invariant under Lorentz...
  15. G

    Internal vector symmetry of Dirac Lagrangian

    Homework Statement Find the conserved Noether current j^\mu of the Dirac Lagrangian L = \bar{\psi} ( i \partial_\mu \gamma^\mu - m ) \psi under the transformation: \psi \rightarrow e^{i \alpha} \psi \,\,\,\,\,\,\,\,\,\, \bar{\psi} \rightarrow e^{-i \alpha} \bar{\psi} Homework Equations...
  16. E

    Lagrangian problem of a cylinder on inclined plane and two springs

    Homework Statement A cylinder on a inclined plane is rolling without slipping. Inclined plane is connected to wall with a spring and cylinder is connected to wall with a spring too. All frictions will be neglected, and all the given data has shown on the image below. As seen above, k2 spring...
  17. C

    Find the Lagrangian of a System of Particles

    Homework Statement Ok, so in this system, there are two point particles of mass M connected by massless levers of length L. The pair of masses pivots about the upper point and rotates about the axis at an angular frequency ω. The lower mass is constrained to slide on the vertical axis. The...
  18. S

    What Is the Compact Group of Global Symmetry for This Lagrangian?

    Hi guys, have a very tricky question on my HW to find compact group of global symmetry to this Lagrangian of 2 complex scalar fields L={\partial_\mu \phi_1^*}{\partial_\mu \phi_1}+{\partial_\mu \phi_2^*}{\partial_\mu \phi_2}-\lambda(\phi_1^* \phi_1 - \phi_2^* \phi_2 - v^2)^2 and I can't figure...
  19. T

    MTW Ch7: Choosing Lagrangian for Scalar Potential

    I have managed to get to the end of Chapter 6 and have done almost all of the exercises (I didn't get anywhere with exercise 5.6 (d) and have seen the Cesarth/TSny exchange and still don't feel I have a satisfactory solution...) but I have hit a bit of a wall with Exercise 7.1 (a).First question...
  20. Breo

    Internal Symmetries (Prove Lagrangian is invariant)

    Homework Statement Note: There is an undertilde under every $$\phi$$ Imagine $$ \phi ^t M \phi $$ . M is a symmetric, real and positive matrix. Prove L is invariant: $$ \mathcal{L} = \phi ^t M \phi + \frac{1}{2} \partial_\mu \phi ^t \partial ^\mu \phi $$ Trick: Counting parameters. Homework...
  21. E

    Gauge invariance of interaction lagrangian

    Anyone can help me how to argue that interaction lagrangian is invariant under gauge transformation?
  22. K

    Help -- Writing Lagrangian in different Representations

    Okay, so I am trying to understand on how to write Lagrangian in different representations. I know the formula of the SU(3) lagrangian in terms of the 3 and 3* rep. Now presume I have a model in the SU(3) 10 plet rep which includes exotic fermions not in the SM. How would I write out the...
  23. Alexandre

    How to derive lagrangian for any classical system?

    Suppose I come up with a system that has certain number of particles with certain masses and are interconnected between each other in a certain way and are acted by forces which are also part of the system. What's the general rule for finding potential and kinetic energies as functions of...
  24. R

    The Effective Lagrangian of the Electromagnetic Field

    hi to everyone L=T-V as you know it is the lagrangian equation the effective Lagrangian of the electromagnetic field is given by following relation in gaussian units. L=(1/8pi) (E^2-B^2) how is must calculate this relation? (the energy density of electromagnetic fields is given by u=(1/8pi)...
  25. Xenosum

    Symmetry Condition for Scaling a Lagrangian?

    Homework Statement Take the action S = \int d^4x \frac{1}{2} \left( \partial_{\mu}\phi(x)\partial^{\mu}\phi(x) - m^2\phi^2(x) - g\phi(x)^p \right) , and consider the following transformations: x^{\mu} \rightarrow x^{'\mu} = \lambda x^{\mu} \phi(x) \rightarrow \phi^{'}(x) =...
  26. KleZMeR

    Invariant quantities of a lagrangian?

    Given a basic Lagrangian, how would I determine invariant quantities? My hunch says it would be quantities that do not depend on position or time? Saying that, perhaps using the Lagrange equation to solve for equations of motion and along the way whatever terms disappear would be my invariant...
  27. C

    Variables in lagrangian vs hamiltonian dynamics

    In the lagrangian formalism, we treat the position ##q## and the velocity ##\dot q## as dependent variables and talk about configuration space, which is just the space of positions. In the hamiltonian formalism we talk about canonical positions and momenta, and we consider them independent. Is...
  28. ChrisVer

    Introduction of the connection in Lagrangian for complex scalar field

    I am having some problem with this attached question. I also attached my answer... My problem is the appearence of the term: 2 e (A \cdot \partial C) |\phi|^2 which shouldn't appear...but comes from cross terms of the: A \cdot A \rightarrow ( A + \partial C) \cdot (A + \partial C) In my...
  29. U

    Eulerian vs Lagrangian approach in fluid mechanics (wave example)

    Hi All, Recently we've been working on the distinction between the Eulerian and Lagrangian approaches in Fluid mechanics. I understand the simpler examples like a running stream of hot water etc. However one example is really tripping me up. So what's confusing me is that in analyzing...
  30. S

    Lagrangian Dynamics: Potential Energy formulation with spring and gra

    Hi, I have a conceptual question regarding Lagrangian dynamics. It has to do with the potential energy formulation. My instructor today mentioned something in class that does not make much sense to me. Here is he most basic example that illustrates my confusion: Take a simple 1dof...
  31. ShayanJ

    Lorentz invariance of Klein-Gordon Lagrangian

    I want to prove the invariance of the Klein-Gordon Lagrangian \mathcal{L}=\frac 1 2 \partial^\mu \phi \partial_\mu \phi-\frac 1 2 m^2 \phi^2 under a general Lorentz transformation \Lambda^\alpha_\beta but I don't know what should I do. I don't know how to handle it. How should I do it? Thanks
  32. J

    How to generalize Newtonian and Lagrangian mechanics

    If I stated a problem that you have to find the solution [0,\infty[\;\to\mathbb{R},\quad t\mapsto x(t) to the problem x(0) = x_0 < R \dot{x}(0) = v_0 > 0 m\ddot{x}(t) = -\partial_x U\big(x(t)\big),\quad\quad m>0 where R, v_0, m are some constants, and the function U has been defined...
  33. N

    Maximizing Symmetry in Lagrangian for a Particle in 3D Cylindrical Coordinates

    Homework Statement the question is that there is a particle in 3 spatial Euclidean dimensions in cylindrical coordinates. I want to find a symmetry for the lagrangian if the potential energy is function of r and k.theta+z V=V(r,k.theta+z) Homework Equations k is constant L=T-V...
  34. N

    Find Symmetry for Lagrangian in 3D Cylindrical Coordinates

    the question is that there is a particle in 3 spatial Euclidean dimensions in cylindrical coordinates. I want to find a symmetry for the lagrangian if the potential energy is function of r and k.theta+z V=V(r,k.theta+z) any help please ?
  35. P

    Lagrangian of Two Masses on a Table

    This is a problem from the Goldstein text. It gives two point masses ##m_1## and ##m_2## connected by a string (negligible mass), where ##m_2## is suspended by the string through a hole in a smooth table; ##m_1## rests on the table. It is important to note that ##m_2## only travels in a vertical...
  36. nmbr28albert

    The Lagrangian Solution of an LC Circuit

    One way to solve the simple LC circuit with 1 inductor and 1 capacitor is to use the Lagrangian formulation of mechanics and consider charge q as the generalized coordinate. When writing down your Lagrangian, the energy of the inductor \frac{1}{2}L(\frac{dq}{dt})^2 is treated as the kinetic...
  37. R

    Derivation of the Lagrangian for Rotating Polar Coordinates

    I'm reading Leonard Susskind's The Theoretical Minimum Vol. 1. 1. The problem: I'm on the section in which he asks the readers to derive the Lagrangian for a particle on a rotating carousel in polar coordinates. 2. Relevant ideas: The same Lagrangian in Cartesian coordinates is given as...
  38. C

    What are the main differences between Hamiltonian and Lagrangian mechanics?

    Homework Statement So I just learned how to derive the equation of motion under the Lagrangian formulation which involves finding the euler-lagrange equation when setting the change in action to zero, chain rule, integration by parts etc.. Then I learned how to find the equations of motion...
  39. &

    Conceptual questions on Lagrangian formalism

    Hi all, I have a (hopefully) quick conceptual question that I'd like to clear up with your help. Is the following argument for why we treat position and velocity as independent variables in the Lagrangian correct? (referring to classical mechanics) : The Lagrangian, \mathcal{L} of a given...
  40. C

    Constructing conserved current from lagrangian

    Homework Statement Consider the following Lagrangian for a massive vector field $A_{\mu}$ in Euclidean space time: $$\mathcal L = \frac{1}{4} F^{\alpha \beta}F_{\alpha \beta} + \frac{1}{2}m^2 A^{\alpha}A_{\alpha}$$ where ##F_{\alpha \beta} = \partial_{\alpha}A_{\beta} -...
  41. Greg Bernhardt

    Lagrangian Definition and Summary

    [SIZE="4"]Definition/Summary The Lagrangian is a function that summarizes equations of motion. It appears in the action, a quantity whose extremum (minimum or maximum) yields the classical equations of motion by use of the Euler-Lagrange equation. In quantum mechanics, the action, and thus...
  42. P

    Setting up the Lagrangian Multipliers method for spherical coords

    This isn't really a homework question, but may be similar to a typical example problem so I posted it here. Homework Statement I want to find the max and min dot product of a 3d vector and all points in a sphere constrained by angles in spherical coordinates. Homework Equations A point...
  43. T

    Vector Calculus Question in Lagrangian Mechanics

    Hi guys. I hope this isn't a bad place to post my question, which is: I'm reading some lecture notes on Lagrangian mechanics, and we've just derived the Euler-Lagrange equations of motion for a particle in an electromagnetic field. It reads: m \ddot{\vec{r}} = -\frac{e}{c} \frac{\partial...
  44. H

    Lagrangian density, regular Lagrangian, E&M

    Greetings, I have two semi-related questions. 1. When making the Lagrangian formalism of electrodynamics, why is it that we use the Lagrangian density \mathcal{L}, rather than the plain old regular Lagrangian L? Is this something that is necessary, or is it more that it is just very...
  45. G

    I need a recommendation on a book for Lagrangian Mechanics

    I have just started studying Lagrangian Mechanics, and I can find decent material on the internet that describes the theory behind it, several proofs on equivalence and even some good solved examples. However, I would really appreciate if someone could recommend a book that has some of the...
  46. Alexandre

    Why does this Lagrangian seem "asymmetric"?

    I got this Lagrangian on the exam and it just seems weird to me: L = \frac{m}{2}(ẋ²+ẏ²) – eBẋy What I mean by "asymmetric" is that it doesn't seem to behave in a same way on x as on y, because there is ẋ in the last term and y but there is no ẏ and x. Deriving Euler-Lagrange equations I get: ẍ...
  47. Coffee_

    A question about conservation of momentum (Lagrangian)

    http://imgur.com/QhYG54l The image seems to be not showing here is the link : http://imgur.com/QhYG54lWhat does Landau mean here by the Lagrangian remaining ''unchanged''. Is it the value of the lagrangian as a function that may not change or is it the form that may not change? Also how does...
  48. Coffee_

    The Lagrangian of a free particle. (mv²/2)

    Hello everyone, I've been having trouble with the following reasoning for a while. The book I use for learning is Landau and Lifschitz vol1. When the concept of the Lagrangian is introduced in textbooks it is some abstract function of the position vector, velocity vector and time. Then they try...
  49. 5

    Time-Dependent Classical Lagrangian with variation of time

    Hello everyone! I was reading the following review: http://relativity.livingreviews.org/open?pubNo=lrr-2009-4&amp;page=articlesu23.html And I got stuck at the first equation; (10.1) So how I understand this is that there are two variations, \tilde{q}(t)=q(t)+\delta q(t)...
  50. J

    Variation of Lagrangian under Lorentz transformations

    Homework Statement Prove that under an infinitesimal Lorentz transformation: x^\mu \to x^\mu+\omega^\mu_\nu x^\nu so: \phi\to\phi-\omega^\mu_\nu x^\nu\partial_\mu\phi the Lagrangian varies as: \delta \mathcal{L}=-\partial_\mu(\omega^\mu_\nu x^\nu \mathcal{L}) The Attempt at a...
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