Understanding the US Physics Graduate School System
Full Chapter List - So You Want To Be A Physicist... Series
Part I: Early Physics Education in High schools
Part II: Surviving the First Year of College
Part III: Mathematical Preparations
Part IV: The Life of a Physics Major
Part V: Applying for Graduate School
Part VI: What to Expect from Graduate School Before You Get There
Part VII: The US Graduate School System
Part VIII: Alternative Careers for a Physics Grad
Part VIIIa: Entering Physics Graduate School From Another Major
Part IX: First years of Graduate School from Being a TA to the Graduate Exams
Part X: Choosing a Research area and an advisor
Part XI: Initiating Research Work
Part XII: Research work and The Lab Book
Part XIII: Publishing in a Physics Journal
Part XIV: Oral Presentations
Part XIII: Publishing in a Physics Journal (Addendum)
Part XIV: Oral Presentations – Addendum
Part XV – Writing Your Doctoral Thesis/Dissertation
Part XVI – Your Thesis Defense
Part XVII – Getting a Job!
Part XVIII – Postdoctoral Position
Part XIX – Your Curriculum Vitae
Table of Contents
Understanding the US Graduate School System
We are still in the discussion of your fourth and final year of college. This time I’ll explain the US graduate school system, especially for readers from other countries who plan to continue their graduate education in the United States. From conversations I’ve had, there is often confusion about what is required to apply for a Ph.D. program in physics in the US.
Undergraduate versus graduate degrees
The broad division of higher education in the US for physics is: (i) undergraduate education and (ii) graduate education. When you complete your undergraduate physics education you typically earn a Bachelor of Science (B.Sc.). Some schools award a Bachelor of Arts (B.A.) in physics, but that’s a different path we won’t discuss here. This B.Sc. is what we call your undergraduate degree.
If you go on to graduate school, the two common physics degrees are the Master of Science (M.Sc.) and the Doctor of Philosophy (Ph.D.).
The key US difference: you can apply to Ph.D. programs with a B.Sc.
Here is where US institutions differ from many systems elsewhere. In the US, if you intend to pursue a doctorate in physics, you do not need to first obtain an M.Sc. Practically all US universities require only an undergraduate degree to apply to a Ph.D. program. Admissions committees evaluate your undergraduate degree and transcripts when considering your application.
By contrast, in some countries (for example, the UK) students often do an M.Sc. before starting a Ph.D. In US programs, students admitted to a Ph.D. program with a B.Sc. often earn an M.Sc. “along the way” after they have fulfilled the requirements for that degree. Some students never formally request the M.Sc. and will list only their B.Sc. and Ph.D. on their CVs.
Why this creates confusion
Two common sources of confusion for international students are:
- Program length: Many people are surprised that the average US physics Ph.D. takes about 5½ to 6 years. They compare this to the UK figure of ~3 years and think the US is much longer. The difference is that the US time is measured from enrollment in a Ph.D. program after a B.Sc., whereas the UK time is often measured from the start of the Ph.D. after an M.Sc. (an M.Sc. can add ~2 years). The total time from a B.Sc. to Ph.D. ends up being similar across systems once you account for when the clock starts.
- Whether you must have an M.Sc. first: Some international applicants assume they must earn an M.Sc. before applying to a US Ph.D. program. As a result, some either stay home for an M.Sc. or apply to an M.Sc. in the US and then later reapply to Ph.D. programs. That creates extra application fees, duplicate paperwork, visa-status changes and delays that could have been avoided by applying directly to Ph.D. programs if eligible.
So remember: check the Ph.D. admission requirements at each US institution. Most require a B.Sc., not an M.Sc. If your goal is a Ph.D., apply directly to the Ph.D. programs using your B.Sc. degree.
Next Chapter: Part VIII: Alternative Careers for a Physics Grad
PhD Physics
Accelerator physics, photocathodes, field-enhancement. tunneling spectroscopy, superconductivity
First – thanks so much for putting this out there – many don’t know it.
The other issue with applying to graduate programs in the US from outside the US is countries like the UK, India and Australia do not have 4 year Bachelors. Some of these are recognised as equivalent (eg a 3 year degree from Oxford) – but some are not. I know Australian 3 year Bachelors generally are not – but you can get 4 year degrees by doing a double degree or an honours year – these are recognised. My suggestion if you are in one of these countries is do either an honours degree or a double degree in physics/applied math. But getting a Masters first is probably even better because that will give valuable experience in research work and only takes an extra semester over a four year degree.
Thanks
Bill
Another point that I think I should make… in the US, there is not even an official standard for which courses a B.S. in physics should require! (likewise for a B.A.) Different schools can (and do) require somewhat different sets of courses. If a school strays too far from a sort of general consensus pattern, then their regional accrediting agency is likely to question their requirements and make them justify them or even change them, but this still allows for some variation.
In some fields, professional organizations publish standards that schools can adhere to, voluntarily, for their B.S. programs. For example, the American Chemical Society has this:
[URL=’http://www.acs.org/content/acs/en/about/governance/committees/training/acsapproved.html’][SIZE=4]ACS Approval Program for Bachelor’s Degree Programs[/SIZE][/URL]
[SIZE=4]Schools that meet these requirements can advertise themselves as “ACS accredited”. However, the American Physical Society does not have a similar program.[/SIZE]
[SIZE=4]Yet another point: in the US, course requirements for a degree are usually intended to be mininum requirements. Students can and do take courses beyond the ones that are specifically required, even beyond any number of elective courses that they are required to take, depending on what they plan to do with the degree. I have the impression that in some countries, degree requirements are very complete and rigid, so this may cause some confusion.[/SIZE]
“the names are a semi-arbitrary choice of the university?”
There’s no standard distinction between B.A. and B.S. in the United States.
Some schools (such as the college where I did my undergraduate) offer only a B.A. in physics, some offer only a B.S.
Some schools offer both a B.A. and a B.S., in which case the B.A. may be less “rigorous” in terms of physics courses, or it may simply include a larger number of “general education” classes outside of physics, for example in languages, history, etc.
I’m pretty sure graduate schools in the U.S. don’t pay any attention to the precise title of the bachelor’s degree, but instead look at the actual courses that you have taken and how well you did in them.
It’s somewhat arbitrary I think. It even happens with some master’s degrees. My graduate program actually did not offer an M.S. (or M.Sc.) in physics, only a Master of Arts (M.A.) or a Ph.D. The M.A. degree did not require a thesis component. So perhaps this is why it was not called an M.Sc. Additionally, one could not even apply to the program with the goal of leaving with the M.A. You had to apply to the Ph.D. program and either declare the M.A. “along the way” to the Ph.D. or leave the Ph.D. program after getting the M.A.
Very helpful post! I have a question regarding the 2nd paragraph – what’s the difference between a B.A. in physics and a B.Sc? I thought that the two are identical and the names are a semi-arbitrary choice of the university? Is there a significant advantage of getting one over the other? (in the U.S. at least?)